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Re: Modify blockquote element definition to allow citations

From: Steve Faulkner <faulkner.steve@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 20 Aug 2013 11:55:50 +0100
Message-ID: <CA+ri+VmhWq-9Whs6NLkKGdTp=Or-yz9bU21+Tck_LPprh1ztPQ@mail.gmail.com>
To: Leif Halvard Silli <xn--mlform-iua@xn--mlform-iua.no>
Cc: "Jukka K. Korpela" <jukka.k.korpela@kolumbus.fi>, HTMLWG WG <public-html@w3.org>
Hi Leif,

thanks for doing a thorough sift, its useful,

>An examination of your file,[1] hints that that is a wildly exaggerated

OK :-) so how about a good number ignore.

>Btw, why not also investigate pre-HTML5 pages?

I used the HTML5 subset as I had it on hand and considered it to be most
likely the freshest, but feel free to review a wider sample the data and
newer larger samples are available at http://webdevdata.org



HTML 5.1 <http://www.w3.org/html/wg/drafts/html/master/>

On 20 August 2013 00:35, Leif Halvard Silli <
xn--mlform-iua@xn--mlform-iua.no> wrote:

> Steve Faulkner, Mon, 19 Aug 2013 15:04:12 +0100:
> > .i.e. removing restrictions to use currently in the spec and which most
> > authors ignore anyway
> An examination of your file,[1] hints that that is a wildly exaggerated
> claim:
> If we ignore, ”naked” (classless) elements (except <cite> and
> <footer>), then the documents you dug up appears to contains 171
> instances of ”source meta data” inside <blockquote> elements, versus
> 126 instances of ”source meta data” outside (in elements adjacent to)
> <blockquote>. Thus ”inside blockquote” was used 57% of the time, while
> “outside blockquote” was used 43% of the time.
> In more detail, for accuracy: In your files, I found 1389 nonempty (and
> non-JavaScript code) occurrences of blockquote. Out of these, then, the
> instances of “inside <blockuote>” looked as follows:
> 1) 19 <footer>s, several of which were from same web sites/authors
> 2) 123 <cite> (5 of which were child of <footer>, and 2 of which
>    where child of an element of class "author".)
> 3) 36 occurrences of class="author" on various child elements of
>    <blockquote>.
> 4) Some last-child “naked” elements (without @class) or <cite>,
>    were used to designate metadata/authors. Amongst these were
>    3 <address> elements, all of which contained a <cite>.
>    Regarding inside <blockquote>, I also observed:
> A) 41 occurences of <h1>-<h6> elements and 6 of <section>,
>    proving that outlines occur, in the wild, in <blockquote>.
> B) 7 occurences of <header> elements.
> C) Some of the blockquote elements were inappropriate as they were
>    used for styling or for other “practical” reasons, like indent.
>    The instances of *adjacent* to <blockquote>, looked as follows:
> a) There were 68 occurrences of class=aut(hor) outside blockquote,
>    typically on an element right after (adjacent to) the blockquote.
> b) There were 58 <cite> outside <blockquote>, all/most of which
>    were used to attribute the author of the quote.
> c) There were some 'naked' (classless) adjacent elements after the
>    blockquote element were used to provide the name of the author.
> Btw, why not also investigate pre-HTML5 pages?
> [1] https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/377471/blockquote.html
> --
> leif halvard silli
Received on Tuesday, 20 August 2013 10:57:02 UTC

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