- From: Silvia Pfeiffer <silviapfeiffer1@gmail.com>
- Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 18:33:21 +1000
- To: Laura Carlson <laura.lee.carlson@gmail.com>
- Cc: HTML WG <public-html@w3.org>, Sam Ruby <rubys@intertwingly.net>, Chris Wilson <Chris.Wilson@microsoft.com>, Maciej Stachowiak <mjs@apple.com>, Anne van Kesteren <annevk@opera.com>, Catherine Roy <ecrire@catherine-roy.net>, Gez Lemon <gez.lemon@gmail.com>, Leif Halvard Silli <lhs@malform.no>, Philip TAYLOR <p.taylor@rhul.ac.uk>, Robert J Burns <rob@robburns.com>, Roger Johansson <roger@456bereastreet.com>, W3C WAI-XTECH <wai-xtech@w3.org>
Just a note of clarification: When I referred to "this mailing list" I was actually talking about the WHATWG mailing list. Apologies. On the public-html mailing list there were also some discussions, but not much technology experimentation yet. Regards, Silvia. On Wed, Jun 24, 2009 at 6:27 PM, Silvia Pfeiffer<silviapfeiffer1@gmail.com> wrote: > Hi Laura, > > Let me just share a note on efforts in Multimedia accessibility. > > There has been work produced and discussed over the last months in > this group about video accessibility, e.g. > http://wiki.whatwg.org/wiki/Video_captioning and > https://wiki.mozilla.org/Accessibility/Video_a11y_Study08 and much > more. > > However, it has been decided that the first version of HTML5 <video> > (and <audio>) will not have an in-built solution for captions, audio > annotations and the like, because it is possible to do such with > javascript and external files. It has also been stated that after some > experimentation and experience, the idea is that a second version of > HTML5 should have a solution to this. > > There are people outside the WHATWG experimenting with such issues. > There are even chats between different browser vendors about this. > Once some more discussion and experimental implementations are > available, the discussion will certainly flare up again and go across > W3C working groups. At the 2008 TPAC, there were some initial > discussions between some members of WAI, public-html, and WHATWG > groups, just to make sure basic requirements are understood. > > So, basically the answer to the low number of discussions on > Multimedia accessibility on this mailing list is that it's time hasn't > come yet. But it certainly hasn't been forgotten and several example > implementations using javascript exist (at least for captions, which > is a first step). > > Best Regards, > Silvia. > > On Wed, Jun 24, 2009 at 4:32 PM, Laura > Carlson<laura.lee.carlson@gmail.com> wrote: >> Hi Ian, >> >>>> We request that the accessibility design principle be disambiguated and >>>> strengthened by replacing it with the following definition text and two >>>> examples: >>>> >>>> "We will design all features so as to ensure that they are accessible to >>>> users with disabilities. >> >>> I strongly agree with this. >> >> That’s great. >> >>>> To this end, we will look to the W3C WAI groups for guidance, listen to >>>> their advice, and collaborate with them to reach mutually agreeable >>>> accessibility solutions. >>> >>> I agree with this also. >> >> That’s great too. >> >>> Note that "listen to" does not mean "obey", and >>> "mutually agreeable accessibility solutions" may not be those that the WAI >>> groups initially propose. >> >> This is correct. >> >>> As far as I can tell, the proposed text matches what the working group has >>> been doing already. >> >> What has been missing in principle and in practice in that specific >> portion of the proposal is *collaborating with WAI groups* to reach >> *mutually agreeable* accessibility solutions. Lack of collaboration >> has impeded mutually agreeable issue resolution. >> >> For example, on Bruce Lawson's "Alternate text in HTML 5" blog post >> regarding CG Consensus Resolutions on Text alternatives in HTML 5, >> Anne van Kesteren commented [1]: >> >>> Having looked at the document I am disappointed that it is just >>> a list of recommendations we are supposed to take for granted(?) >>> without providing any kind of rationale. >>> >>> In my view it does not really address the critical questions that >>> have been raised e.g. regarding longdesc but just states how that >>> group of people think things should work. >>> >>> On IRC this was characterized as A) “I’d like you to do X” B) >>> “There are some issues with X, e.g. …” A) “I’d like you to do X”. >>> That is no way of having a discussion in my opinion. >> >> Besides the Text Alternatives issue [2] there has been no >> collaboration between WAI and HTML WG on following issues in the past >> two years. >> >> http://esw.w3.org/topic/HTML/SummaryForTable >> http://esw.w3.org/topic/HTML/AddedElementCanvas >> http://esw.w3.org/topic/HTML/MultimediaAccessibilty >> >> The table headers issue [3] is the only progress that has happened >> with the accessibility issues. That took people from PF and the HTML >> WG actually talking, truly debating, and collaborating at a >> face-to-face meeting. I think that collaboration is about only way to >> move the accessibility issues forward. >> >> People need to respect each other. IRC and the blogs aren't helping. >> The comments are vicious [4] [5]. >> >> If HTML5 is going to be accessible, people are going to have to work >> together. Everyone has something to bring to the table. Youth can >> bring energy and fresh knowledge. Older people can offer experience >> and wisdom that can only come from years of real life experience. >> >> The HTML and WAI working groups should be collaborating, reaching >> higher, and seeking/finding ways of advancing accessibility >> solutions…not merely trying to maintain the status quo and trying to >> prevent regression due to removal of features without functional >> replacements. >> >> The primary markup language of the World Wide Web should be aiming to >> extend the range of communication and make the web more accessible. >> Can the groups work together in a sincere effort to make HTML 5 the >> best solution ever for everyone including people with disabilities? >> >> Best Regards, >> Laura >> >> [1] http://www.brucelawson.co.uk/2009/alternate-text-in-html-5/#comment-613950 >> [2] http://esw.w3.org/topic/HTML/IssueAltAttribute >> [3] http://esw.w3.org/topic/HTML/IssueTableHeaders >> [4] http://krijnhoetmer.nl/irc-logs/html-wg/20090611#l-118 >> [5] http://www.brucelawson.co.uk/2009/alternate-text-in-html-5 >> >> -- >> Laura L. Carlson >> >> >
Received on Wednesday, 24 June 2009 08:34:19 UTC