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Re: PROPOSAL: Procedure to Promote Progress With Accessibility Issues in HTML5

From: David Poehlman <david.poehlman@handsontechnologeyes.com>
Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 08:05:58 -0400
Cc: Laura Carlson <laura.lee.carlson@gmail.com>, Sam Ruby <rubys@intertwingly.net>, Chris Wilson <Chris.Wilson@microsoft.com>, HTML WG <public-html@w3.org>, W3C WAI-XTECH <wai-xtech@w3.org>, wai-liaison@w3.org, Janina Sajka <janina@rednote.net>, "Michael(tm) Smith" <mike@w3.org>, Dan Connolly <connolly@w3.org>, Michael Cooper <cooper@w3.org>, Gez Lemon <gez.lemon@gmail.com>, Robert J Burns <rob@robburns.com>
Message-Id: <72867A90-5B09-4BA9-ADA9-1D2F8B742669@handsontechnologeyes.com>
To: Ian Hickson <ian@hixie.ch>
I do not see this response as coverage for moving forward with it.   
What am I missing?  I see/hear your issues, but this is not the thread  
in which the vent them as I understand the process?

On Jul 19, 2009, at 7:39 AM, Ian Hickson wrote:

On Sun, 19 Jul 2009, Laura Carlson wrote:
>
> To that end, we propose that the HTML working group adopt the  
> following
> statement as an official procedure and publish it in HTML working  
> group
> Web space.
>
> Procedure to Promote Progress With Accessibility Issues in HTML5
>
> Procedure Overview:
>
> The HTML WG will look to the W3C WAI groups for guidance, listen to
> their advice, and collaborate with them to reach mutually agreeable
> accessibility solutions. Furthermore, collaboration will be promoted  
> in
> a pro-active manner, i.e., whenever possible, design features known or
> foreseen to have an impact on accessibility will be explored and
> discussed with the Protocols and Formats Working Group (PFWG) [2]  
> prior
> to decisions in order to ensure mutually beneficial resolution of
> issues.

Laura, in the interests of the collaboration you espouse, could you  
reply
to the e-mail I wrote to you last month?

   http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2009Jun/0669.html


> Collaboration Framework:
>
> 1. Approach issues on the basis of the shared goal of making HTML 5
> the best solution for everyone, including people with disabilities.

This should mean working for accessibility as a whole, not working for
specific features. For example, in the context of tables, it should mean
focusing on making tables accessible, not focusing on the summary=""
attribute to the exclusion of discussion of other solutions. (I have  
been
informed that in fact the WAI groups are more interested in voting on
whether summary="" is in or out than on voting on what accessibility
solutions should be used to make tables accessible, for instance.)

Can we get a commitment from members of the WAI to approach issues on  
the
basis of the shared goal of making HTML 5 the best solution for  
everyone,
including people with disabilities and people without disabilities?


> 2. Work from concrete issues as to what in HTML 5 needs to be improved
> by asking PFWG to clearly identify accessibility functional  
> requirements
> and provide rationale.

I most recently tried to approach the WAI on the topic of <canvas>:

   http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/wai-xtech/2009Jun/0093.html

I've yet to receive any concrete functional requirements suggestions for
changes to the specification on this topic from the WAI (although I have
received several suggestions from members of the HTMLWG who are not
members of the WAI). I am still hopeful that the WAI will clearly  
identify
accessibility functional requirements and provide rationale. Is there  
any
chance the WAI could provide an ETA for such advice on this topic?


> 3. Listen to their input, ask for clarification, and work together to
> devise solutions to satisfy accessibility requirements.

I have asked for clarifications, for example in June, regarding tables:

   http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2009Jun/0173.html

I received an official reply to the effect that my questions were not
welcome because they were not from a group:

   http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2009Jul/0260.html

...and my reply to that, asking about which groups would qualify to  
get a
reply, received no replies at all:

   http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2009Jul/0262.html


> 4. Ask PFWG if proposed solutions meet accessibility requirements.
>  * If they say no, ask what functionality is still needed and
> continue the collaboration.

As noted above, I did this with <canvas>, and received no concrete
replies. (I received many thanks, but no technical replies.)


I look forward to further collaborations with the WAI, and hope that
concrete advice such as the advice you suggest that we ask for will be
forthcoming.

Cheers,
-- 
Ian Hickson               U+1047E                )\._.,--....,'``.    fL
http://ln.hixie.ch/       U+263A                /,   _.. \   _\  ;`._ ,.
Things that are impossible just take longer.   `._.-(,_..'--(,_..'`-.;.'
Received on Sunday, 19 July 2009 12:06:40 UTC

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