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Re: ACTION-128: Draft @summary voting text in conjunction with PF

From: Ian Hickson <ian@hixie.ch>
Date: Tue, 7 Jul 2009 20:27:32 +0000 (UTC)
To: Joshue O Connor <joshue.oconnor@cfit.ie>
Cc: public-html@w3.org, wai-xtech@w3.org
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.62.0907072022410.1060@hixie.dreamhostps.com>
On Tue, 7 Jul 2009, Joshue O Connor wrote:
> > On Mon, 6 Jul 2009, Joshue O Connor wrote:
> >> It may be better to just simplify the example altogether by 
> >> displaying the characteristic on the far left column, and then follow 
> >> with the negative/positive columns.
> > 
> > If we did that, the table would be trivial enough not to need a 
> > summary at all.
> 
> This table doesn't need one. It is not a complex data table.

Do you have any suggestions of a table that is complex enough to need an 
explanation but can be fully written in 20 lines, 25 at the most, written 
one element to a line?


> I was referring to the <caption> and <figure> examples. They would be 
> better if the table was how I suggested, displaying the characteristic 
> (Mood/Grade) on the far left column, and then followed with the 
> corresponding negative/positive columns.

I agree that the table would be better in general with the headers on the 
left rather than in the middle. So far it's the best that I have, though.


> You need two examples. The one that is there will suffice but could be 
> improved IMO and the example Gez provided is a perfect example of a 
> complex data table that needs @summary. [1]
>
> [1] http://juicystudio.com/wcag/tables/complexdatatable.html

I agree that that is a table than needs explanatory text (though frankly 
the text really should be visible to all users -- I don't think users of 
ATs are the only ones who need help with that table), but unfortunately 
it's far too long to be included in the spec, IMHO. I don't want to have 
pages and pages of markup in the examples.


> > Unfortunately that is far too long to actually fit in the spec as an 
> > example that is repeated many times. I'd really like something 20 
> > lines long, 25 at the most (written one element to a line, as now).
> 
> It only needs to be referred to once, as an example of a complex data 
> table that is made accessible by the use of @summary. The other more 
> simple table would suffice for the rest of the <caption>, <figure> and 
> <details> examples in the spec.

I am quite attached to the style of examples that always include all the 
content. I find that examples that refer to other examples are less clear, 
and as this is a difficult topic in the first place, clarity is important.

-- 
Ian Hickson               U+1047E                )\._.,--....,'``.    fL
http://ln.hixie.ch/       U+263A                /,   _.. \   _\  ;`._ ,.
Things that are impossible just take longer.   `._.-(,_..'--(,_..'`-.;.'
Received on Tuesday, 7 July 2009 20:28:09 UTC

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