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Minutes of HTML WG meeting, Apr 8 2010

From: Paul Cotton <Paul.Cotton@microsoft.com>
Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2010 16:52:53 +0000
To: "public-html-wg-announce@w3.org" <public-html-wg-announce@w3.org>
Message-ID: <E3EACD022300B94D88613639CF4E25F802D773AA@TK5EX14MBXC134.redmond.corp.microsoft.com>
Minutes for the HTML WG meeting on April 8 can be found below and at:
http://www.w3.org/2010/04/08-html-wg-minutes.html

Paul Cotton, Microsoft Canada
17 Eleanor Drive, Ottawa, Ontario K2E 6A3
Tel: (425) 705-9596 Fax: (425) 936-7329


[W3C]<http://www.w3.org/>

- DRAFT -
HTML Weekly Teleconference
08 Apr 2010

Agenda<http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-wg-announce/2010AprJun/0000.html>

Attendees
Present
Regrets
Chair
Several people volunteered on the list.
Scribe
paulc
Contents

  *   Topics<http://www.w3.org/2010/04/08-html-wg-minutes.html#agenda>
     *   1. ACTION items due by Thu Apr 8<http://www.w3.org/2010/04/08-html-wg-minutes.html#item01>
     *   2. Call for Proposals/Counter Proposals that close by Thu Apr 8<http://www.w3.org/2010/04/08-html-wg-minutes.html#item02>
     *   3. Items that close next week (by Thu Apr 15)<http://www.w3.org/2010/04/08-html-wg-minutes.html#item03>
     *   4. New Calls for Proposals/Consensus this Week<http://www.w3.org/2010/04/08-html-wg-minutes.html#item04>
     *   5. New Calls for Counter Proposals this Week<http://www.w3.org/2010/04/08-html-wg-minutes.html#item05>
     *   6. New Issues This Week<http://www.w3.org/2010/04/08-html-wg-minutes.html#item06>
     *   7. New Change Proposals This Week<http://www.w3.org/2010/04/08-html-wg-minutes.html#item07>
     *   8. Issues under discussion<http://www.w3.org/2010/04/08-html-wg-minutes.html#item08>
     *   9. No Task Force Reports<http://www.w3.org/2010/04/08-html-wg-minutes.html#item09>
     *   Any other Business<http://www.w3.org/2010/04/08-html-wg-minutes.html#item10>
     *   Adjournment<http://www.w3.org/2010/04/08-html-wg-minutes.html#item11>
  *   Summary of Action Items<http://www.w3.org/2010/04/08-html-wg-minutes.html#ActionSummary>

________________________________

<pimpbot> planet: A Closer Look at Internet Explorer 9 Hardware Acceleration Through Flying Images <11http://blogs.msdn.com/ie/archive/2010/04/07/a-closer-look-at-internet-explorer-9-hardware-acceleration-through-flying-images.aspx>

<pimpbot> changes: hixie: Revamp how <object> type handling works, as the previous model was getting impenetrable and didn't match _any_ browsers. This one should more or less match Gecko and avoids known security problems with the previous model. Please let me know if you're a browser vendor and cannot implement this for whatever reason. (whatwg r4985) <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-diffs/2010Apr/0158.html>

<pimpbot> changes: hixie: Remove conformance requirements for processing profile=''. (whatwg r4986) <11http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-diffs/2010Apr/0159.html>

<pimpbot> planet: Is there a WebSocket client implemented for.NET? <11http://stackoverflow.com/questions/2064641/is-there-a-websocket-client-implemented-for-net>

<pimpbot> planet: HTML5 and the myth of WAI-ARIA redundance <11http://www.paciellogroup.com/blog/?p=585>

<pimpbot> planet: Your Questions Answered #6 <11http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/html5doctor/~3/79mL0oCPpb0/> 4** What browsers support html 5 websocket? <11http://stackoverflow.com/questions/1252829/what-browsers-support-html-5-websocket>

<pimpbot> Title: {agenda} HTML WG telcon 2010-04-08: calls for proposals, issue status from Maciej Stachowiak on 2010-04-07 (public-html-wg-announce@w3.org from April to June 2010) (at lists.w3.org)

<rubys> meeting hasn't started... awaiting chair.

<rubys> no zakim

<Julian> i c

how do we invite zakim?

<rubys> trackbot, start meeting

<trackbot> Date: 08 April 2010

<scribe> agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-wg-announce/2010AprJun/0000.html

<pimpbot> Title: {agenda} HTML WG telcon 2010-04-08: calls for proposals, issue status from Maciej Stachowiak on 2010-04-07 (public-html-wg-announce@w3.org from April to June 2010) (at lists.w3.org)

do we need to invite rssagent as well?

<mjs> hi everyone

<mjs> dialing now

<scribe> scribe: paulc
1. ACTION items due by Thu Apr 8

.

The Chairs moved some actions to next week.

None this week.
2. Call for Proposals/Counter Proposals that close by Thu Apr 8

<mjs> issue-99

Issue-99 Call for proposals closed this week.

<rubys> issue-99?

<trackbot> ISSUE-99 -- meta/@scheme missing -- RAISED

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/99

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-99 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

REsolution: Close Issue-99 without prejudice due to lack of propoals by deadline.

<mjs> issue-102?

<trackbot> ISSUE-102 -- Registration procedure for meta/@name -- RAISED

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/102

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-102 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

Resolution: Close Issue-102 without prejudice due to lack of proposals by deadline.

<mjs> issue-104?

<trackbot> ISSUE-104 -- Clarify that mime type sniffing is optional -- OPEN

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/104

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-104 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

Resolution: Close Issue-104 without prejudice due to lack of proposals by deadline.

<rubys> close issue-99

<trackbot> ISSUE-99 meta/@scheme missing closed

Julian: He is looking at these and MAY submit proposals in the future.

<rubys> comment Issue-99 without prejudice due to lack of propoals by deadline

<rubys> trackbot, comment Issue-99 without prejudice due to lack of propoals by deadline

<trackbot> Sorry, rubys, I don't understand 'trackbot, comment Issue-99 without prejudice due to lack of propoals by deadline'. Please refer to http://www.w3.org/2005/06/tracker/irc for help

<pimpbot> Title: IRC Trackbot (at www.w3.org)

<mjs> http://dev.w3.org/html5/status/issue-status.html
3. Items that close next week (by Thu Apr 15)

<pimpbot> Title: Change Proposal Status (at dev.w3.org)

Issue-9?

<trackbot> ISSUE-9 -- how accessibility works for <video> is unclear -- RAISED

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/9

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-9 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

Target date is April 12 and is in discussion by A11Y TF.

Issue-27?

<trackbot> ISSUE-27 -- @rel value ownership, registry consideration -- OPEN

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/27

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-27 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

We had some people volunteer to test the registry and they were to report next week.

But the related Internet Draft is not yet progressed and the action may not be done if the registry is not yet available.

WG will review status next week.

Issue-94?

<trackbot> ISSUE-94 -- Split Web Application Core and UA specific elements into separate spec -- OPEN

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/94

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-94 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

Shelley submitted a proposal and the Chairs feedback is that the proposal needs more work.

Shelley indicated that she could probably not fill in the details and the Chairs are giving the WG a week to determine if someone else could do the required proposal upgrade.

Otherwise Issue-94 would be closed next week without a better proposal is available.
4. New Calls for Proposals/Consensus this Week

issue-105?

<trackbot> ISSUE-105 -- allow image maps on the canvas element -- RAISED

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/105

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-105 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

Proposal was recevied right after the CfC.

<mjs> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/wiki/ChangeProposals/addimagemaptocanvas

<pimpbot> Title: ChangeProposals/addimagemaptocanvas - HTML WG Wiki (at www.w3.org)

issue-106?

<trackbot> ISSUE-106 -- Return the concept of Obsolete but conforming back to using obsolete and deprecated -- RAISED

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/106

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-106 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

<mjs> http://dev.w3.org/html5/status/issue-status.html#ISSUE-0106

<pimpbot> Title: Change Proposal Status (at dev.w3.org)

Call for Proposals was issue for Issue-106 this week - closes on May 6.

Issue-94?

<trackbot> ISSUE-94 -- Split Web Application Core and UA specific elements into separate spec -- OPEN

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/94

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-94 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

The Chairs issued a Call for Revision to upgrade the proposal for issue-94.
5. New Calls for Counter Proposals this Week

The Chairs issues several requests for counter proposals:

Issue-90, Issue-91, Issue-93, Issue-95, Issue-96, Issue-97

Issue-90?

<trackbot> ISSUE-90 -- Tighten the focus and allowable content in the figure element -- OPEN

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/90

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-90 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

Issue-91?

<trackbot> ISSUE-91 -- Re-focus and tighten definition of the aside element -- OPEN

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/91

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-91 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

Issue-93?

<trackbot> ISSUE-93 -- Delete Details Element -- OPEN

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/93

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-93 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

Issue-95?

<trackbot> ISSUE-95 -- Remove/Discard the Hidden Attribute -- OPEN

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/95

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-95 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

Issue-96?

<trackbot> ISSUE-96 -- Remove/Discard the Progress Element -- OPEN

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/96

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-96 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

Issue-97?

<trackbot> ISSUE-97 -- Remove/Discard the Meter Element -- OPEN

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/97

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-97 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

The Chairs are willing to accept a single counter proposal for the above issues.

Cynthia: Who volunteered to work on the counter proposals?
... A11Y TF also wants to express its position on these issues.
... A11Y TF passed a resolution AGAINST the original change proposals.
... TF wants to keep these elements.

TF minutes are at:

http://www.w3.org/2010/04/06-html-a11y-minutes.html

<pimpbot> Title: HTML Accessibility Task Force Teleconference -- 06 Apr 2010 (at www.w3.org)

http://www.w3.org/2010/04/07-html-a11y-minutes.html

<pimpbot> Title: HTML Accessibility Task Force Teleconference -- 07 Apr 2010 (at www.w3.org)

Cynthia: Correction - this was a F2F resolution and needs to be confirmed by the TF.

<rubys> volunteers to coordinate with can be found here: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2010Apr/0204.html

<pimpbot> Title: Re: ISSUE-90, ISSUE-91, ISSUE-93, ISSUE-95, ISSUE-96, ISSSUE-97: (new semantic elements/attributes) - Chairs Solicit Alternate Proposals or Counter-Proposals from Maciej Stachowiak on 2010-04-06 (public-html@w3.org from April 2010) (at lists.w3.org)
6. New Issues This Week

Issue-105?

<trackbot> ISSUE-105 -- allow image maps on the canvas element -- RAISED

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/105

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-105 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

<scribe> New issue and there is a Call for Proposal which has been responded to.

Issue-106?

<trackbot> ISSUE-106 -- Return the concept of Obsolete but conforming back to using obsolete and deprecated -- RAISED

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/106

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-106 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

<scribe> New issue and there is a call for proposals.

Issue-107?

<trackbot> ISSUE-107 -- Politics in fallback example for plugin usage -- RAISED

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/107

<Julian> issue-107?

<trackbot> ISSUE-107 -- Politics in fallback example for plugin usage -- RAISED

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/107

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-107 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-107 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

Julian: Issue-107 was Raised after the agenda was prepared.
7. New Change Proposals This Week

We have new change proposal for Issue-56.

Issue-56?

<trackbot> ISSUE-56 -- Bring "URLs" section/definition and IRI specification in alignment. -- OPEN

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/56

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-56 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

This alternate proposal suggest changes to the IRIbis draft to make the HTML5 spec text simpler.

<scribe> Chair: Questions

None

We have a new proposal for Issue-81.

<mjs> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2010Apr/att-0158/rr6.html

<pimpbot> Title: Change Proposal: Gloss standard terminology for representation (at lists.w3.org)

Issue-81?

<trackbot> ISSUE-81 -- Offline Web Applications section should use the term "representation" instead of "resource" -- OPEN

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/81

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-81 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

This proposal arrived a few days late and discussion is going on the list.

Ian has offered modified text. Hoping for friendly resolution.

Issue-86?

<trackbot> ISSUE-86 -- HTML5 relaxes Atom requirement on atom:id stability -- OPEN

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/86

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-86 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

<Julian> updated change proposal for ISSUE-86 (based on Tim Bray's feedback): http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2010Apr/0291.html

<pimpbot> Title: Re: change proposal for issue-86, was: ISSUE-86 - atom-id-stability - Chairs Solicit Proposals from Julian Reschke on 2010-04-08 (public-html@w3.org from April 2010) (at lists.w3.org)

Julian: Change proposal was updated based on Atom Chair feedback.
... Feedback came from Tim Bray.
... Other feedback from Atom WG experts is to consider dropping this feature.
... Feedback is that there are other problems with the algorithm in the spec.
... We should keep the "drop the feature" idea on the table.

Issue-105?

<trackbot> ISSUE-105 -- allow image maps on the canvas element -- RAISED

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/105

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-105 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

<mjs> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/wiki/ChangeProposals/addimagemaptocanvas

<pimpbot> Title: ChangeProposals/addimagemaptocanvas - HTML WG Wiki (at www.w3.org)

As mentioned above we have a proposals for issue-105.

<scribe> Chair: Not much discussion on this list so far.

PaulC: How does this relate to work of the A11Y TF?

<scribe> Chair: Issue-74 covered canvas accessibility which had a couple of proposals.

<scribe> Chair: This is a separate proposal for solving the problem.

<scribe> Chair: TF has endorsed one of the Issue-74 proposals.

<Laura> Allowing usemap on canvas will provide a method to easily add interactive areas to a canvas. The method is familiar to developers and is conceptually simple. Interactive areas are keyboard accessible by default and expose role/name/state/descitpion information to assitive technology.
8. Issues under discussion

Issue-56?

<trackbot> ISSUE-56 -- Bring "URLs" section/definition and IRI specification in alignment. -- OPEN

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/56

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-56 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

Both I18N WG and HTML WG are discussing this issue.

Issue-81?

<trackbot> ISSUE-81 -- Offline Web Applications section should use the term "representation" instead of "resource" -- OPEN

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/81

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-81 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

Still under discussion on WG list.

Issue-82?

<trackbot> ISSUE-82 -- Suggested replacement for head/@profile does not provide for disambiguation -- OPEN

<trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/82

<pimpbot> Title: ISSUE-82 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)

Julian issued a change proposal and some changes are being made to the spec. DOM part is pending.
9. No Task Force Reports

Ordinarily we have task force reports this week.

Chairs decided to delay this for one week since A11Y TF facilitators are both travelling.
Any other Business

<Zakim> adrianba, you wanted to mention the polyglot document

Tony, Eliott and Adrian met this week to start work on this.

Eliott hopes to upload a template for the document.

Hoping to have some material in another couple of weeks.

How will input be solicited?

Eliott has been in touch with Mike Smith for a CVS location.

Adrian: Call for Volunteers contained some info and that will be used to gain input from the identified sources.

<Julian> note on ISSUE-86: there's no Atom (AtomPub) Working Group; I was referring to the ex-co-chair, and people subscribed to the atom-syntax mailing list

Adrian: Once there is a document outline then it will be identified for the WG to comment on.

Paul will scribe next week.

Paul is interested in feedback on the scribing today.
Adjournment

<Julian> right, and I should have said "anymore" -- I wasn't trying to avoid confusion but wasn't very good at it :-)

Adjourned at :47 after the hour.

<Julian> I *was* trying to avoid confusion; sigh.

rssagent, generate minutes

Summary of Action Items
[End of minutes]
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$Date: 2010/04/08 16:49:25 $




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