{minutes} HTML WG media telecon 2015-07-21 - EME bugs and status

http://www.w3.org/2015/07/21-html-media-minutes.html <http://www.w3.org/2015/07/21-html-media-minutes.html>

TENTATIVE — next meeting is August 4th.

Joe Steele


 <http://www.w3.org/>
HTML Media Task Force Teleconference

21 Jul 2015

Agenda <https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-media/2015Jul/0022.html>
See also: IRC log <http://www.w3.org/2015/07/21-html-media-irc>
Attendees <>
Present
paulc, markw, joesteele, ddorwin, davide, jdsmith, adrianba, cwilso
Regrets
Chair
paulc
Scribe
joesteele
Contents

Topics <http://www.w3.org/2015/07/21-html-media-minutes.html#agenda>
New Issues related to Issue #39 <http://www.w3.org/2015/07/21-html-media-minutes.html#item01>
ISSUE-71 - Be explicit about aborting steps when resolving a promise early <http://www.w3.org/2015/07/21-html-media-minutes.html#item02>
ISSUE-72 - Explicitly define the initial state of the `keyStatuses` attribute <http://www.w3.org/2015/07/21-html-media-minutes.html#item03>
ISSUE-73 - Get Supported Capabilities for Media Type algorithm uses both "media type" and "media types <http://www.w3.org/2015/07/21-html-media-minutes.html#item04>
ISSUE-74 - The WebIDL reference points to the first edition <http://www.w3.org/2015/07/21-html-media-minutes.html#item05>
Issues awaiting actions, re-opened or awaiting implementation <http://www.w3.org/2015/07/21-html-media-minutes.html#item06>
ISSUE-17 Replace "fire a simple event" with "fire an event" for non-simple Events, Assigned to Jerry <http://www.w3.org/2015/07/21-html-media-minutes.html#item07>
ISSUE-20 Ensure session type is correct for loaded sessions, Assigned to Jerry <http://www.w3.org/2015/07/21-html-media-minutes.html#item08>
Initialization Data issue cluster <http://www.w3.org/2015/07/21-html-media-minutes.html#item09>
Event handler and message cluster <http://www.w3.org/2015/07/21-html-media-minutes.html#item10>
Active EME issues and open pull requests <http://www.w3.org/2015/07/21-html-media-minutes.html#item11>
ISSUE-63: Align normative text on user consent for Distinctive Identifiers with privacy section <http://www.w3.org/2015/07/21-html-media-minutes.html#item12>
ISSUE-45: Remove "persistent-release-message" MediaKeySessionType <http://www.w3.org/2015/07/21-html-media-minutes.html#item13>
[EME] Netflix's secure release is unreliable without tamper-proof secure persistent storage and/or delayed shutdown <http://www.w3.org/2015/07/21-html-media-minutes.html#item14>
Media Task Force F2F meeting, TPAC, Sapporo, Japan, Oct 2015 <http://www.w3.org/2015/07/21-html-media-minutes.html#item15>
Next meeting <http://www.w3.org/2015/07/21-html-media-minutes.html#item16>
Summary of Action Items <http://www.w3.org/2015/07/21-html-media-minutes.html#ActionSummary>
<trackbot> Date: 21 July 2015
<paulc> Teleconference information: +1-617-324-0000 Access code: 649 602 452
<paulc> Agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-media/2015Jul/0022.html <https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-media/2015Jul/0022.html>
<scribe> scribenick: joesteele
<paulc> Teleconference information: +1-617-324-0000+1-617-324-0000 Access code: 649 602 452
New Issues related to Issue #39

<paulc> https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/39 <https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/39>
<paulc> Issues 68, 69, 70 and 75 are related to the solution to ISSUE-39
<paulc> Issue-75 is new (after the agenda was sent out)
paulc: seems to be active discussion — anything to add
ddorwin: I think 68-70 make sense regardless, but 75 should go first to make sure we don\’t need to rewrite
<paulc> https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/75 <https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/75> should be done first
… need input from the WebIDL people about the intent of iterable
… or whether the spec is wrong, but see some reasoning for the way they have done it
… ideally their spec is wrong and will be fixed
paulc: 70 is marked to be implemented, neeed to discuss 68 then?
<paulc> https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/70 <https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/70>
ddorwin: I have text I need to add, 69 is define key ID sort order, we can address that
… can figure out what they look like but not implement yet
… folks should comment though
… different byte ordering might be an issue to consider
paulc: have the other folks looked at this?
markw: I have looked and agree so far
jdsmitth: I have not looked yet
joesteele: I have only read it over not talked about internally yet
paulc: having people review would be good then
https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/71 <https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/71>
ISSUE-71 - Be explicit about aborting steps when resolving a promise early

paulc: no comments yet
joesteele: just saw this morning, seems reasonable but need to review our implementation
paulc: would like to resolve as this came out 2 weeks ago
<paulc> Resolve steps proposal: "Therefore, I think we should remove "resolving or " from this statement (and the other two instances) and explicitly abort the load() algorithm in step 8.8.1."
jdsmith: my instinct is that a general rule does not make sense
… but what David is proposing makes senses
markw: nothing from me
<paulc> Reject Steps questions: "I forget why we removed " and abort these steps" from all the reject steps and added these three instances of this statement. Perhaps to be more concise and highlight the unique portions of each such step. It's certainly less text than including that phrase in the approximately 40 such steps, but it is less explicit."
paulc: Jerry, David has a question — does this chaneg anything?
jdsmith: think it is best to be more explicit, is there a style guide?
… don’t remember why we removed that — he is saying it should be restored and that makes sense
ddorwin: no other questions from me
ISSUE-72 - Explicitly define the initial state of the `keyStatuses` attribute

ddorwin: just making this look like the other ones
… Mark avoided “empty” in a bunch of places — this is editorial
https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/72 <https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/72>
<markw> lgtm
joesteele: +1
ISSUE-73 - Get Supported Capabilities for Media Type algorithm uses both "media type" and "media types

https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/73 <https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/73>
ddorwin: also editorial — need a new name though
… current name is confusing
paulc: why not “X”?
<markw> "parameterized codecs"
… I say just pick a new name and move on
<markw> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parkinson%27s_law_of_triviality <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parkinson%27s_law_of_triviality>
<markw> "Parkinson observed and illustrated that a committee whose job was to approve plans for a nuclear power plant spent the majority of its time with pointless discussions on relatively trivial and unimportant but easy-to-grasp issues, such as what materials to use for the staff bike-shed,"
ISSUE-74 - The WebIDL reference points to the first edition

https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/74 <https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/74>
paulc: suggested that you split the references as a 1st step
… I think a new working draft is going out soon, maybe next week
… we have some of the same issues in DOM4
… it is not obvious when and where WebIDL v2 will get to a state where it is not too far behind us
<paulc> See https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/74#issuecomment-123080711 <https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/74#issuecomment-123080711>
paulc: some folks think WebIDL v1 is dead (live spec folks)
… but don’t want to end up being in a place where WebIDL v2 is behind us
ddorwin: think all new web specs are starting to depend on v2
paulc: I will continue to track, but you can resolve by splitting the references
… we can deal with it at last call
Issues awaiting actions, re-opened or awaiting implementation

ISSUE-17 Replace "fire a simple event" with "fire an event" for non-simple Events, Assigned to Jerry

https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/17 <https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/17>
jdsmith: have not sent a note ot the WG yet on this — will do today
<paulc> See http://www.w3.org/2015/07/07-html-media-minutes.html#item03 <http://www.w3.org/2015/07/07-html-media-minutes.html#item03>
ISSUE-20 Ensure session type is correct for loaded sessions, Assigned to Jerry

https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/20 <https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/20>
paulc: some commentary on this issue — Jerry re-opened
<paulc> https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/20#issuecomment-121788748 <https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/20#issuecomment-121788748>
jdsmith: my edit was not correct — want to revert and do something that meets the intent of the bug
… should correspond to sessions being reloaded
… doesn’t confirm there is a match currently
Initialization Data issue cluster

joesteele: I did not do anything external here — still discussing internal and got sidetracked
<paulc> http://www.w3.org/2015/07/07-html-media-minutes.html#item04 <http://www.w3.org/2015/07/07-html-media-minutes.html#item04>
<paulc> This is about ISSUEs 41, 52 and 53.
joesteele: will get something to the TF email list today
Event handler and message cluster

<paulc> http://www.w3.org/2015/07/07-html-media-minutes.html#item05 <http://www.w3.org/2015/07/07-html-media-minutes.html#item05>
jdsmith: busy working on impelemtnations, not enough time to work on the document
<paulc> Issues 19, 14 and 31.
paulc: try for two weeks out?
jdsmith: pretty busy, will prioritize the edits but will try to get this done by Friday
Active EME issues and open pull requests

ISSUE-63: Align normative text on user consent for Distinctive Identifiers with privacy section

https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/63 <https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/63>
paulc: David was going to review
<paulc> See Pull request 66
<paulc> http://www.w3.org/2015/07/07-html-media-minutes.html#item07 <http://www.w3.org/2015/07/07-html-media-minutes.html#item07>
ddorwin: I reviewed, need to review more
… try to get that done by next meeting
ISSUE-45: Remove "persistent-release-message" MediaKeySessionType

https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/45 <https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/45>
ddorwin: these are all waiting for the key renewal to be published
… we is Google
<paulc> http://www.w3.org/2015/07/07-html-media-minutes.html#item09 <http://www.w3.org/2015/07/07-html-media-minutes.html#item09>
markw: pointing out that I will be out for next 2.5 weeks — will not see a response from me in that timeframe
… but you will see a response from me
… back on August 11th
… still working tomorrow though
[EME] Netflix's secure release is unreliable without tamper-proof secure persistent storage and/or delayed shutdown

https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-media/2015Jun/0021.html <https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-media/2015Jun/0021.html>
paulc: think this one is covered by issue 45?
ddorwin: yes — these are all related
Media Task Force F2F meeting, TPAC, Sapporo, Japan, Oct 2015

<paulc> https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-media/2015Jul/0020.html <https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-media/2015Jul/0020.html>
paulc: F2F coming up — proposing that we meet at TPAC
… Oct 26th - Oct 30th
<paulc> Oct 26-30 see http://www.w3.org/2015/10/TPAC/ <http://www.w3.org/2015/10/TPAC/>
paulc: the W3C extended the HTML-WG until end of Sept. This TF will continue in some form on after that
… may be proposed as a separate media working group
… the scope would subsume the MSE and EME work maybe other work as well
… proposal is that we should think about having a F2F of the TF and maybe this new WG that the TF would morph into
… possible that the changes to the new HTML WG won\’t be finalized by then so we think might be worth starting the discussion now
… since folks are taking breaks over the summer
… any comments?
<paulc> The proposed charter for a new (HTML + WebApps) WG = Web Platform WG and the Timed Media WG is athttps://github.com/w3c/charter-html <https://github.com/w3c/charter-html>
paulc: basically would fold WebApps and HTML together, the exception would be the media work
… possible that the TimedMedia WG would own the media elements in the HTML5 spec and would be responsible for changes to those
… e.g. a Transcript element
paulc: concensus that HTML WG has acheived its goal and would go away
… we want to make some changes
<paulc> New ideas for the Web Platform will be incubated in the ICG: https://www.w3.org/community/wicg/ <https://www.w3.org/community/wicg/>
<paulc> The WICG was created on Jul 1 and it came out of discussions at https://github.com/w3c/charter-html <https://github.com/w3c/charter-html>
paulc: this was created on July 1 and came out of that same Github discussion
... might be that we get so much feedback we can’t finish by TPAC, that would mean we extend the WG and TF until later
… if AC approves the charter changes, then the new gorup would meet at TPAC
paulc: any strong objections?
… questions can be sent to Paul or Phillipe or to the public github
paulc: Registration for TPAC is OPEN. Location is in Sapporo, Japan.
… start your planning now. Likely to meet Thursday and Friday
… encourage you to attend Wednesday technical plenary
Next meeting

paulc: was going to suggest August 4th — but with Mark out might go further
markw: you can meet without me
paulc: OK then we will meet on the 4th and the 18th
ddorwin: let\’s see what topics we have for the 4th
… I will be out as well
paulc: I will sen a note the previous week to confirm then
… minutes are clear on what folks actions are
… Aug 3rd is a holiday for me
paulc: thanks for the hard work David
Summary of Action Items <>[End of minutes]
Minutes formatted by David Booth's scribe.perl <http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm> version 1.140 (CVS log <http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/2002/scribe/>)
$Date: 2015/07/21 15:48:54 $