Minutes: HTML A11Y TF Teleconference, 26 JUN 2014

The minutes for the HTML Accessibility Task Force Teleconference 26 June
2014 are available in HTML and plain text below:

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http://www.w3.org/2014/06/26-html-a11y-minutes.html

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W3C
- DRAFT -

HTML Accessibility Task Force Teleconference

26 Jun 2014

See also: IRC log

Attendees

Present
Mark_Sadecki, [IPcaller], Adrian_Roselli, paulc, David_MacDonald, LWatson,
Cynthia_Shelly, McCarron, Judy
Regrets
Chair
Mark
Scribe
ShaneM
Contents

Topics
Identify Scribe
Longdesc
Canvas Sub Group
WAI-ARIA in HTML
Media Sub Group
Bug Triage
HTML 5.1 Next Steps
Other Business
Summary of Action Items
<trackbot> Date: 26 June 2014
<MarkS> Meeting: HTML-A11Y Task Force Teleconference
<MarkS> http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/index.php?title=Scribe_List
Identify Scribe

<MarkS> ShaneM, are you still interested in being our scribe today?
<scribe> ScribeNick: ShaneM
Longdesc

MarkS: unfortunate series of events. just before close we discovered there
was a bug with a comment left on it. a change was accepted and was supposed
to be in the editors draft but was not.

<MarkS> Extension of deadline for longdesc CfC
MarkS: upon further reflection we decided to only partially accept the
change and implement it. This meant the CfC was extended to review the
additional change.

<MarkS> https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=24168
MarkS: CfC is open until tomorrow.

Canvas Sub Group

no meeting this week. still getting progress updates about fixing hitregion
support in chromium. should have a patch.

scribe: last call comment period for the canvas 2d spec closes today. no
comments or new bugs filed.

Actually last call period closed on 20 June. There were no bugs reported in
that time.

Next step is to get the editors to prep a draft CR and offer it up to the
chairs to get a CfC done.

WAI-ARIA in HTML

<MarkS> Using WAI-ARIA in HTML Working Draft published
MarkS: received consensus from TF and PF to publish a heartbeat draft. It
is live now.
... announcement is not yet up.

Media Sub Group

MarkS: no meeting this week for the subgroup.
... are working on drafting comment responses and preparing a new heartbeat
draft. Hope to have it out in two weeks (8 July or 10 July).

Judy: whats up with tv?

MarkS: they had a meeting recently. drafting up their uses cases for round
2. Once those are done the media subgroup will review the use cases again.
... sounds like they may have taken some of our use cases verbatim.

Bug Triage

LJWatson: met yesterday. all 5.0 bugs for a11y are completely cleared.

<LJWatson> https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=13449
LJWatson: a handful of bugs have been reassigned to task force members for
tracking.

<MarkS> 13449 Don't allow blank alt text on area elements
Chaals had offered to put together a test case, but is very busy. Task
Force will relook at it to see if it is still an issue or if there could be
a test case prepared.

aardrian: I can try to create a test case but have never done so before.
Will take a little while. I am tied up for the next few days.

Judy: no one should feel shy about volunteering. Everyone has to do
something for the first time.

<LJWatson> https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=23027
aardrian: I will probably reach out to Mark as things progress.

<MarkS> 23027 select and option should allow role overrides of menu and
menuitem
MarkS: one of the reasons this was considered for 5.0 was that during the
PF closer look at the native aria semantics section the group discovered
some omissions from that section.
... this is another of those. If the others are being considered for roll
into 5.0, then this should be as well.
... will ping Steve about this bug.

ShaneM: is there danger this wont make it into the spec?

cyns: some people will not think this is editorial.

paulc: task force should track this. The TF should ask for it if that is
what we want.

<LJWatson> https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=13572
<MarkS> 13572 4.10.19 aborting autofocus based on user choice not optional
LJWatson: Is there anything relating to this in UAAG?

cyns: I don't think so (not at a computer right now).
... I don't think there are browser settings to override autofocus.
... there might have been a feature request for this. If so, it would have
been a 5.1 feature request. It is not necessary for 5.0.
... reassign to Cynthia

MarkS: (someone) thinks that UAAG section 2.2.4 might apply - separate
focus from selection. Could use that as an argument that user agents should
have this feature.
... I do think this is a valid bug for 5.1

This has been moved out of the HTML component and into the HTML a11y
component. What is the process when it moves back?

LJWatson: We have done that - but the assignee has been Steve so it has not
been awkward.

<MarkS> ACTION: cyns to add more information to
https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=13572 [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2014/06/26-html-a11y-minutes.html#action01]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-274 - Add more information to
https://www.w3.org/bugs/public/show_bug.cgi?id=13572 [on Cynthia Shelly -
due 2014-07-03].
HTML 5.1 Next Steps

<MarkS> http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/51wishlist
<paulc> Using WAI-ARIA in HTML publication: see
http://www.w3.org/blog/news/archives/3933
cyns: I do have an internal meeting scheduled about menus. When we come
back on the 10th I should be able to talk about it.

David: seeing radio buttons with sub groups with nested text boxes.
Confuses screen readers.

cyns: if the text box is inside the label does that work?

David: no. Then you have a nested label.

cyns: we need to figure out the right A11Y pattern to support this - it is
widespread.

MarkS: is there not a technique where you use enabled / disabled
manipulating the DOM? dynamically enable the additional form field?

David: put the text field after the radio buttons and shift focus?

cyns: there should be something we can do with labelling. This is a
sentence where a secondary control forms the end of the sentence.
... it feels like there is a labelling solution but it is going to be
complicated.

MarkS: it sounds like more of a technique.

David: we need to forbid it or design a way to do it accessibly.

MarkS: there is no way to do it with ARIA?

David: I have done a lot of experimenting and cannot come up with a good
pattern.

cyns: can you send the examples to the list?

David: Sure - I need to clean them up a little bit. Next week.

MarkS: Maybe there is a web components solution.

David: it is not forbidden to put another form element inside a label,
right?

cyns: no. and forbidding it wouldn't work. people will do it anyway.

David: the other thing we need to solve is placeholder text... objection is
that the label disappears after someone starts typing.

cyns: I think we can come up with something.

MarkS: I think the placeholder text becomes an accessible description, but
users with cognitive issues may find it challenging that the text disappears

<paulc> See
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2014Jun/0055.html for info
on "editing TF"
MarkS: moving the text into a tooltip might be a way.

paulc: at the html f2f meeting in april was the contenteditable feature in
HTML. There was a feeling that some of that feature should be turned into
an API instead of the mechanism that is in HTML5 today.
... there is a task force about it.

cyns: some overlap with that and IndieUI.

MarkS: I was at the f2f and I did hear a lot of people discussing
contenteditable. The TF should keep an eye on this in 5.1. Thanks for
bringing this to our attention.

Other Business

LJWatson: I can scribe next week.

MarkS regrets for next week as I will be on vacation. paulc is at risk.
cyns will be away on the 10th.

Summary of Action Items

[NEW] ACTION: cyns to add more information to
https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=13572 [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2014/06/26-html-a11y-minutes.html#action01]

[End of minutes]
Minutes formatted by David Booth's scribe.perl version 1.138 (CVS log)
$Date: 2014-06-26 15:50:09 $
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Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00)

Found ScribeNick: ShaneM
Inferring Scribes: ShaneM
Default Present: Mark_Sadecki, [IPcaller], Adrian_Roselli, paulc,
David_MacDonald, LWatson, Cynthia_Shelly, McCarron, Judy
Present: Mark_Sadecki [IPcaller] Adrian_Roselli paulc David_MacDonald
LWatson Cynthia_Shelly McCarron Judy
Found Date: 26 Jun 2014
Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2014/06/26-html-a11y-minutes.html
People with action items: cyns

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