Re: A11Y-Related Change Proposals that need revision

On Jan 21, 2010, at 11:56 PM, Steven Faulkner wrote:

> HI maciej, 
> I am a little confused, if you follow the thread you pointed to I provided updates a few days later [http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2009Dec/0268.html]. I ended up splitting the change proposal into 2 seperate proposals. Was this change registered by the chairs?
> 
> 1. split out and modify parts of Section 4.8.2.1 the img element Change Proposal
> http://esw.w3.org/topic/HTML/ChangeProposals/ImgElement20091209
> 2. Modify img element section Change Proposal
> http://esw.w3.org/topic/HTML/ChangeProposals/ImgElement20091203

I see. Looks like we did miss that - not sure how. For reference, if you don't see a reply or see the Change Proposal recorded on the issue status page, we probably overlooked it. I'll record these new change proposals. However, I'm not sure if you fully address the original comments. The rationale you give for the two things that lacked rationale is:

The intent here is:
	• To allow new methods to be used for providing short text alternatives (e.g. LABELLEDBY)
	• To allow the use of either role="presentation" and/or alt="" to mark "presentational" images.

But that doesn't give a reason, it just repeats back what the change is. Let me know if you'd like to take another try at adding rationale or if we should proceed as-is.

Think in terms of completing the sentence: 'HTML5 should allow the use of either role="presentation" and/or alt="" to mark "presentational" images because...'. I hope you can see how completing it with '... the intent is to allow the use of either role="presentation" and/or alt="" to mark "presentational" images' is a circular argument and therefore does not provide actual rationale. 

Regards,
Maciej


> 
> regards
> steve
> 
> 2010/1/22 Maciej Stachowiak <mjs@apple.com>
> 
> On Jan 21, 2010, at 1:42 AM, Steven Faulkner wrote:
> 
>> Hi Maciej,
>>  
>> >On ISSUE-31, there is currently no tracker action for the needed revisions. Steve, can you give us your estimate of when you plan to be done with revisions, >or an indication that you do not plan to make any changes?
>> are you talking about revisions to the change proposals on the wiki or revisions to the documents asscoiated with the change proposal such as http://www.paciellogroup.com/blog/misc/HTML5/new/img-new.html?
> 
> I'm taking about these review comments about certain things in the Change Proposal itself not having proper rationale: <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2009Dec/0238.html>. Are you planning to make the suggested changes, and if so, when? If you are planning to make further changes to either the Change Proposal itself or supporting documents, feel free to include those in your time estimate.
> 
> Here's the current entry on the status page: <http://dev.w3.org/html5/status/issue-status.html#ISSUE-031>.
> 
> Regards,
> MAciej
> 
> 
>>  
>> regards
>> stevef 
>> 
>> 2010/1/21 Maciej Stachowiak <mjs@apple.com>
>> Hello Cynthia, Steve, and HTML Accessibility TF,
>> 
>> The HTML WG Chairs would like to move forward soon on two accessibility-related Change Proposals, the ones for table-summary (ISSUE-32) and missing-alt (ISSUE-31). We are awaiting revised versions of these before calling for counter-proposals or otherwise moving forward, though at some point we will consider just going what we have and calling for counter-proposals anyway.
>> 
>> On the ISSUE-32 Change Proposal, Cynthia Shelley has the following ACTION, which is overdue: <http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/actions/167>. Cynthia, can you give us a new realistic timeline?
>> 
>> On ISSUE-31, there is currently no tracker action for the needed revisions. Steve, can you give us your estimate of when you plan to be done with revisions, or an indication that you do not plan to make any changes?
>> 
>> Task Force, can you please make these revisions a priority, and give Cynthia and Steve whatever assistance they need?
>> 
>> Regards,
>> Maciej
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -- 
>> with regards
>> 
>> Steve Faulkner
>> Technical Director - TPG Europe
>> Director - Web Accessibility Tools Consortium
>> 
>> www.paciellogroup.com | www.wat-c.org
>> Web Accessibility Toolbar - http://www.paciellogroup.com/resources/wat-ie-about.html
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> with regards
> 
> Steve Faulkner
> Technical Director - TPG Europe
> Director - Web Accessibility Tools Consortium
> 
> www.paciellogroup.com | www.wat-c.org
> Web Accessibility Toolbar - http://www.paciellogroup.com/resources/wat-ie-about.html