W3C home > Mailing lists > Public > public-esw-thes@w3.org > October 2004

Gnowsis

From: Miles, AJ (Alistair) <A.J.Miles@rl.ac.uk>
Date: Thu, 14 Oct 2004 18:32:08 +0100
Message-ID: <350DC7048372D31197F200902773DF4C05E50CAB@exchange11.rl.ac.uk>
To: 'Leo Sauermann' <leo@gnowsis.com>
Cc: public-esw-thes@w3.org
Hi Leo,
 
N.B. the proposal [1] involves adding the properties 'skos:subject'
'skos:isSubjectOf' 'skos:primarySubject' and 'skos:isPrimarySubjectOf' ...
the name 'hasSubject' is not part of the proposal (just trying to avoid
spurious use of non-existent SKOS properties :)
 
The Gnowsis tool sounds great ... looking forward to a release. 
 
Al. 
 
[1] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-esw-thes/2004Oct/0081.html
<http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-esw-thes/2004Oct/0081.html>  
 

 

Sidebar
	Resources
	
Concepts
  Projects
     ALOHA
      BETA
     GNOWSIS
        development
        meetings
           21.7.2004-DFKI
         presentations
            10.9.2004-DFKI
     SKOS
        thesauri
 Topics
   Semantic Web
   Ui design
   DFKI
   .... 
	Emails
   sadfasdfsadf
   asdfasdfasdf

Appointments
  asdfasdf
   asdasdfasdff

Files
   harhar.pdf
   test.doc
	

So the idea is to have a knowledge management application.
A tree made out of SKOS ConceptSchemes on the left.
When a Concept is selected, the associated resources of the user are shown
to the right.

The tree is always visible and I can drag/drop resources into it.

The key point is:
I want to replace all these bad folder structures and email folder
structures and bookmark folder structures with this SKOS structures.
And I want to have all applications share the same SKOS.


So, you esw-thes people out there, 
wouldn't this be a fine thing for Semantic Web?

(in the next gnowsis alpha release, I have coded it....
I coded today the interfaces similiar to your skos api.
and a project management tool to show the idea  :-)

cheers
Leo

[1] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-esw-thes/2004Oct/0081.html
<http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-esw-thes/2004Oct/0081.html> 

[2]  http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-esw-thes/2004Sep/0041.html
<http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-esw-thes/2004Sep/0041.html> 
[3] http://www.gnowsis.org <http://www.gnowsis.org> 
[4] http://leobard.twoday.net/stories/360443/
<http://leobard.twoday.net/stories/360443/> 

Es begab sich aber zu der Zeit 14.10.2004 16:24,  da Miles, AJ (Alistair)
schrieb:


Hi Leo,



To answer the easiest question first, the 'traditional' way to use SKOS

concepts is as the values in a subject-based index of documents.  There is a

proposal on the table [1] for a 'skos:subject' property, which basically

behaves in the same way to the 'dc:subject' property, i.e. you will be able

to state:



<rdf:RDF /*standard namespaces*/>



  <rdf:Description rdf:about= "http://foo.com/somedoc.html"
<http://foo.com/somedoc.html> >

    <skos:subject rdf:resource= "http://bar.com/some#concept"
<http://bar.com/some#concept> />

  </rdf:Description>



</rdf:RDF>



Of course, there are many other scenarios emerging in which SKOS concepts

can be used (and your use case is expanding the set I had imagined so far

:).  For example, a SKOS concept can be depicted by an image, or a SKOS

concept could be a topic of interest or expertise for a person ...



Anyway.  Another set of scenarios (including yours I think) requires us to

be able to express a relationship between a SKOS concept and an RDFS/OWL

Class/Individual that 'intends'/'represents'/'denotes' the same (or similar)

thing.  This requirement was the basis for the original 'skos:denotes'

proposal [2] which has been argued for by danbri (see e.g. [3]).



However, others have argued that a relationship of meaning between a SKOS

concept and an RDFS/OWL Class/Individual is essentially the same as a

mapping relationship between two SKOS concepts (see e.g. [4]).  Or in other

words, there is no difference in the level of abstraction between a SKOS

concept and an RDFS/OWL Class/Individual.  Hence a 'skos:denotes' property

is not appropriate.



So this debate is currently poised :)  



I'm just thinking, perhaps a more detailed description of your requirements

here could help us with this problem ... could you expand a little on these

for us?



Thanks,



Alistair.



[1]  http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-esw-thes/2004Oct/0081.html
<http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-esw-thes/2004Oct/0081.html> 

[2]  http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-esw-thes/2004Sep/0041.html
<http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-esw-thes/2004Sep/0041.html> 

[3]  http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-esw-thes/2004Sep/0067.html
<http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-esw-thes/2004Sep/0067.html> 

[4]  http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-esw-thes/2004Oct/0005.html
<http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-esw-thes/2004Oct/0005.html> 







-----Original Message-----

From:  public-esw-thes-request@w3.org
<mailto:public-esw-thes-request@w3.org> 

[ mailto:public-esw-thes-request@w3.org
<mailto:public-esw-thes-request@w3.org> ]On Behalf Of Leo Sauermann

Sent: 14 October 2004 09:46

To:  public-esw-thes@w3.org <mailto:public-esw-thes@w3.org> 

Subject: Re: [Proposal][SKOS-Core] skos:denotes





Danbri:



  

RDF tries to impose some basic design constraints across all projects

that use it, to make things easier for data-merging, extensibility

etc. What we're doing with skos:represents (or whatever it gets

called) is coming up with a little add-on that helps SKOS-based RDF

data work better with non-SKOS RDF data.

    





I could not follow the whole discussion, because I began thinking about skos

a week ago

http://leobard.twoday.net/stories/360443/
<http://leobard.twoday.net/stories/360443/> 



My Goal is:



I want to build stuctures that are independent of nromal RDF instances, that

means: I want to model things like "Job" 

"Private" "ProjectX" and form these things as SKOS:Concepts



then I have emails, files, photos, websites, etc that I want to add to these

SKOS:concepts



Ideal:

SKOS concepts

REAL LIFE Resources



JOB

 - Project X

     - Meeting 23.10.2004

 - Project Y

Email "skos;denoites"

File "skos image"

Website "skos website"

Website  "http://www.w3.org/2001/sw" <http://www.w3.org/2001/sw> 





now I want

<meeting 23.10.2004> <????>   <http://www.w3.org/2001/sw>
<http://www.w3.org/2001/sw>





the problem:

You forgot to add somehting to skos that allows to acutally USE skos.

A thesaurus /taxonomy/  whatever is only useful when I can link it to

external RDF resources,



All predicates in SKOS are having domain/range skos Concepts,

but SKOS concepts are a closed thing and I want to create triples from skos

to the outer world.

The "real" resources out there in the world are of type email, file, person,

vcard, vEvent



So, please,

tell me which property I have to use to hang real resources to a SKOS

concept.

is this SKOS:denotes?



is it dc:hasPart ?



cheers

Leo



  
Received on Thursday, 14 October 2004 17:32:41 UTC

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