RE: Fixed layout titles and real problems today

Hello again,

 

If the fixed layout titles also have media overlays, as in children’s picture books, could the   correct reading order of the text be extracted and made available separately? Do children’s picture books normally highlight the text as it is spoken?

 

Best

George

 

 

From: Ken Jones <ken@circularsoftware.com> 
Sent: Thursday, March 18, 2021 4:29 AM
To: kerscher@montana.com
Cc: public-epub-wg@w3.org
Subject: Re: Fixed layout titles and real problems today

 

Hi George and WG folks

 

As the fixed layout EPUB standard allows the presentation of multiple text elements on a single page, indicating the correct reading order becomes vital to the understanding of that page for those who are relying on text to speech.

 

I put this concern as the top priority in my notes on Accessibility in Fixed Layout EPUB that I posted here <https://paper.dropbox.com/doc/Accessibility-in-Fixed-Layout-EPUB--BHJp6pGoFBPzWC4LsEFKb98gAg-3il8mlIqLpUfHHhcZEmgy> .

 

The reason the reading order is often incorrect in fixed layout is that, in my experience, the ordering or elements in the EPUB code is rarely considered by illustrated publishers. Even when it is, it can’t be easily shown, predicted or altered by content creators.


My company's software CircularFLO <https://www.circularsoftware.com/apps/circularflo>  has accessibility tools that can be used by the InDesign user to visually indicate and alter the reading order of a publication whilst still in InDesign. This information is then used to reorder the text in the resulting XHTML on export with CircularFLO. For complex layouts, careful consideration to the z-order needs to be given if we don't want to risk altering the appearance of the layout.

 

We hope to add more to this work so that image descriptions, even for large composite background images, can also be added into the reading order in the most suitable location.

 

What you are looking for here though seems to be a tool to alter the reading order of existing fixed layout EPUBs when we have no access to the source creation files.

 

I can't see how this can be totally automated, how can the correct reading order be known? The position of text on the page both vertically and horizontally, the stacking order, the styling, even the tag hierarchy can give us clues but can not give us definitive answers.

 

If I were asked to solve this problem and to provide a tool to fix existing fixed layout EPUBs, my approach would be similar to how I have tackled it in InDesign with CircularFLO. I would suggest the creation of a web app which opened any fixed layout EPUB and markers added which visually overlaid the reading order on top of each page element.

 

The user would then be walked through the publication, page by page, so the order could be quickly approved, or if a change was needed the order could be indicated by the user clicking or dragging these visual markers to correct order. Any changes to the order would then be made to the underlying EPUB content in the corresponding XHTML.

 

If we made this web app simple to use, perhaps this could be done at scale in an affordable way. Either by publishers themselves or maybe by volunteers, or by professionals that were either crowd sourced or working offshore.

 

I’m keen to help on this and the whole topic of fixed layout accessibility where I can.


Thanks
Ken

Ken Jones
Director
Circular Software Limited
circularsoftware.com <http://circularsoftware.com> 

ken@circularsoftware.com <mailto:ken@circularsoftware.com> 
+44 (0)7974 458642
@CircularKen <https://twitter.com/CircularKen> 
linkedin.com/in/kenjones <http://linkedin.com/in/kenjones> 





On 17 Mar 2021, at 20:24, <kerscher@montana.com <mailto:kerscher@montana.com> > <kerscher@montana.com <mailto:kerscher@montana.com> > wrote:

 

Hello WG folks,

 

I know we are working on the best ways to create a fixed layout specification that will be accessible. However, there are many that are on the market today. Are there techniques to transform these into something that is accessible? I mean what do we do when a child with a disability needs to be reading the same picture book as everybody else? If the child is learning with a refreshable braille display, they need to get at the text in the correct reading order.

 

If there is something you can think of that could be automated for a large set of titles, that would be good to know.

 

Best

George

 

 

 

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George Kerscher Ph.D.

-In our Information Age, access to information is a fundamental human right.

Chief Innovations Officer, DAISY Consortium

 <http://www.daisy.org/> http://www.daisy.org

Senior Advisor, Global Literacy, Benetech

 <http://www.benetech.org/> http://www.benetech.org

President, International Digital Publishing Forum (IDPF) 

 <http://www.idpf.org/> http://www.idpf.org

Member of the National Museum and Library Services  Board (IMLS)

 <http://www.imls.gov/> http://www.imls.gov

Chair Steering Council Web Accessibility Initiative (WAI), at W3C

 <http://www.w3.org/WAI> http://www.w3.org/WAI

Phone: +1 406/549-4687

Cell:+1 406/544-2466 

Email:  <mailto:kerscher@montana.com> kerscher@montana.com