Re: EOCred: Identify the level of a credential

Fritz, I agree that the notion of "level" can be complex, but need not be
so. I would eliminate your second and third notions because: (1) the second
would and should be identified as a distinct credential (Bachelor os
Science in Software Engineering); and (2) the third is not an inherent
characteristic of the credential (as work) but rather the level of an
awarded credential--e.g., "Joe earned his Bachelor of Science in Software
Engineering Summa Cum Laude".

As Phil has noted elsewhere, the European take on the latter might be
different since, I believe, there is a closer tie in identifying
credentials to level of accomplishment.

On Wed, Feb 14, 2018 at 9:10 PM, Fritz Ray <fritley@gmail.com> wrote:

> I'll let Robby chime in and explain my understanding of Level better than
> I can.
>
> Level has at least three senses of the word that are applicable, that I
> have found.
>
>    - There is a general sense of someone's capability as defined by a
>    level, such as a novice, beginner, intermediate, journeyman, advanced,
>    expert, professional, etc. *Sometimes* these have formal (but not
>    necessarily specific) definitions, but much of the time they are just
>    labels for a person's capability in that credential. They don't take much,
>    if any expertise to identify or understand though, and that makes them
>    useful to non-practitioners. I see this as being used more in competencies
>    and less in credentials, but I am including it for contrast.
>
>    - There's a formal and specific sense of someone's capability in
>    breadth and depth in this credential and a subset of more granular courses
>    or other competency granting things. These are most commonly ascribed to
>    credentials. A *Bachelor's of Science* in Software Engineering
>    indicates so many credit hours of mandatory technical, social, math, etc,
>    so many credit hours of elective classes, and additional projects. That is,
>    the credential's level indicates the courses and competencies obtained.
>
>    Note: It is often correct to think of these as different credentials,
>    since an Associate's degree and a Bachelor's degree have different
>    requirements, but they are both in the same domain, so thinking of them as
>    levels is common.
>
>    - And then there's a technical and specific sense of someone's
>    capability, which could be considered "SMART" -- Specific, Measurable,
>    Achievable, Realistic and Time-Oriented. A *Summa Cum Laude*
>    Bachelor's of Science in Software Engineering includes the implication of
>    an algorithm or rubric (in this case of the individual's GPA) and the
>    measurement against some thresholds (3.85 / 4.0 and above). Awards for
>    Olympic achievements like breaking the Olympic record, for instance,
>    include this sense.
>
>    Note: It is often impractical to think of these as different
>    credentials, since each Olympic record breaking credential would require a
>    different description for its specific 'credential'.
>
> I don't pretend to have definitive nomenclature for each of these (and I'm
> not sure anyone does), but "Naive/General Level, (Tiers, Ranks, Levels),
> and Performance Level" tend to be accepted.
>
> I'd describe the first definition with _just_ short strings or terms, the
> middle definition with links to more specific credentials, and the latter
> with some sort of performance profile, like a rubric, or performance
> record, like the data indicating someone broke an Olympic record.
>
> Note: The third definition may be outside current capabilities to
> describe. I already accept this.
>
> On Tue, Feb 13, 2018 at 4:24 AM, Phil Barker <phil.barker@pjjk.co.uk>
> wrote:
>
>> Thank you for all the discussion so far. I have tried to summarise where
>> we are with describing the level of a credential in a draft on the wiki
>> <https://www.w3.org/community/eocred-schema/wiki/User:Philbarker/Draft:Educational_level_of_a_credential>.
>> I have gone with direct references to terms that described educational
>> levels, without any AlignmentObjecting
>>
>> In doing so I have tried not to refer to credentials explicitly, because
>> I think this property might be useful for Courses and learning resources in
>> general, but I am open to input on that if you think that it makes the
>> definition unnecessarily vague.
>>
>> The main issue I see is whether educationalLevel is the right name. If it
>> is not, I suspect that Robbie has started writing his reply before reading
>> this far :) I am very open to wording from people involved in occupational
>> credentialling and workplace learning for wording that is more inviting to
>> their community.
>> As ever, all comments welcome.  Phil
>>
>>
>> [draft educationaLevel] https://www.w3.org/community/e
>> ocred-schema/wiki/User:Philbarker/Draft:Educational_level_of_a_credential
>>
>>
>> On 07/02/18 12:27, Phil Barker wrote:
>>
>> The next use case I would like to discuss is around identifying the level
>> of an educational / occupational credential currently stated as: it should
>> be possible to search or review results of a search by specific credential
>> level, e.g. post-graduate, High school, entry, intermediate, advanced.
>>
>> To do this we need to be able to relate an educational / occupational
>> credential to a description or representation of an educational level. I
>> see two options for this:
>>
>> A. we do the same as is currently done for learning resources and courses
>> and use the educationalAlignement
>> <http://schema.org/educationalAlignment>property to point to an
>> AlignmentObject <http://schema.org/AlignmentObject> which in turn points
>> to and/or describes an educational level.
>>
>> B. we add a new property educationalLevel which could point to either an
>> AlignmentObject or directly to a DefinedTerm for the educational level.
>>
>> I'm interested in anyone's thoughts on which they would prefer.
>>
>>
>> =A bit of background to the AlignmentObject.=
>>
>> - the educationalAlignment / AligmentObject pairing is useful when you
>> don't want to pre-define and thus limit types of alignments involved by
>> having a few properties for specific alignments (that's at the root of why
>> LRMI introduced it, here we have a specific alignment type we know we want.)
>>
>> - the AlignmentObject is useful when the thing to which you are aligning
>> is not properly defined a a firstclass schema.org object; it allows you
>> to refer to it by description
>>
>> - the AlignmentObject is useful when you want to say things about the
>> alignment itself (e.g. describe who asserts the alignment is true and how
>> they came to this judgement) though this ability is under developed and to
>> my knowledge not used
>>
>> - research <https://dl.acm.org/citation.cfm?id=3054160>[*] into LRMI
>> schema.org markup in the wild suggests that the AlignmentObject (and
>> relatively more complex / abstract approaches in general) are used less
>> frequently than simpler property - value [literal] relationships.
>>
>> - the Open Badges spec uses an alignment property to point from a badge
>> class to an AlignmentObject representing objectives or educational
>> standards (which is slightly different to this use case, though we several
>> use cases for aligning to competencies)
>>
>>
>> Please let me know your thoughts.
>>
>> Phil
>>
>>
>> * open access copy of that paper at https://blogs.pjjk.net/phil/co
>> nfpaper/analysing-improving-embedded-markup-learning-resources-web/
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Phil Barker <http://people.pjjk.net/phil>. http://people.pjjk.net/phil
>> PJJK Limited <https://www.pjjk.co.uk>: technology to enhance learning;
>> information systems for education.
>> CETIS LLP: a cooperative consultancy for innovation in education
>> technology.
>>
>> PJJK Limited is registered in Scotland as a private limited company,
>> number SC569282.
>> CETIS is a co-operative limited liability partnership, registered in
>> England number OC399090
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Phil Barker <http://people.pjjk.net/phil>. http://people.pjjk.net/phil
>> PJJK Limited <https://www.pjjk.co.uk>: technology to enhance learning;
>> information systems for education.
>> CETIS LLP: a cooperative consultancy for innovation in education
>> technology.
>>
>> PJJK Limited is registered in Scotland as a private limited company,
>> number SC569282.
>> CETIS is a co-operative limited liability partnership, registered in
>> England number OC399090
>>
>
>


-- 
Stuart A. Sutton, Metadata Consultant
Associate Professor Emeritus, University of Washington
   Information School
Email: stuartasutton@gmail.com
Skype: sasutton