Re: Glossary defn of dataset, metadata

oops! resending to the group.

On 04/28/2015 08:51 AM, yaso@nic.br wrote:
> Hi Annete,
>
> On 04/27/2015 05:06 PM, Annette Greiner wrote:
>> Hi Yaso!
>> I meant to refer to the entire sentence "This section contains the 
>> best practices to be used by data publishers in order to help them 
>> and data consumers to overcome the different challenges faced during 
>> the data on the Web lifecycle.”
>> Does my comment make sense to you?
>
> Yes, perfectly. I had the same feeling while reading this sentence. 
> But as it was there and I did not find any records about the decision 
> about not talking about the Web lifecycle I tried to figure out a 
> solution. Indeed, it is better to suppress this sentence :-)
>
> yaso
>
>> -Annette
>>
>> --
>> Annette Greiner
>> NERSC Data and Analytics Services
>> Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory
>> 510-495-2935
>>
>> On Apr 27, 2015, at 12:18 PM, yaso@nic.br <mailto:yaso@nic.br> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Annete!
>>>
>>> Do you refer to the data on the web lifecycle?
>>>
>>> All the best,
>>> yaso
>>>
>>>
>>> On 04/24/2015 06:19 PM, Annette Greiner wrote:
>>>> Can we toss that sentence?
>>>> In my opinion, that is a big step back from our previous agreement 
>>>> on how to state the audience. It doesn’t really clarify anything, 
>>>> and it just delays getting into the BPs themselves. I really think 
>>>> we need to follow E.B. White’s advice: omit needless words.
>>>> -Annette
>>>> --
>>>> Annette Greiner
>>>> NERSC Data and Analytics Services
>>>> Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory
>>>> 510-495-2935
>>>>
>>>> On Apr 24, 2015, at 12:26 PM, yaso@nic.br <mailto:yaso@nic.br> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Yes, I liked that too!
>>>>>
>>>>> Phil, can I give you access for my fork of dwbp? I'm still with 
>>>>> questions about the right place to put your text, if in the BP doc 
>>>>> or in the Glossary.
>>>>>
>>>>> And, I still miss more conexion between our lifecycle and this 
>>>>> mental models. For me, the scope delineated by Deirdre needs to be 
>>>>> explicitly connected with the lifecycle that is cited in the BP 
>>>>> doc at:
>>>>>
>>>>> "This section contains the best practices to be used by data 
>>>>> publishers in order to help them and data consumers to overcome 
>>>>> the different challenges faced during the data on the Web lifecycle."
>>>>>
>>>>> BTW, the word lifecycle shouldn't contain a link to the image 
>>>>> proposed by Bernadette[1]? It is difficult to identify which 
>>>>> lifecycle we are referring to...
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Yaso
>>>>>
>>>>> [1] https://github.com/w3c/dwbp/blob/gh-pages/images/lifecyclesvg.svg
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On 04/24/2015 11:05 AM, Annette Greiner wrote:
>>>>>> I think this is great. I really like the way you describe the example. However, the bit about the overlap between data and metadata is a large amount of text for a very fine point. Could we keep that bit to one or two sentences at most? Right now I feel like the single biggest barrier to use of our document is its length.
>>>>>> -Annette
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Annette Greiner
>>>>>> NERSC Data and Analytics Services
>>>>>> Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory
>>>>>> 510-495-2935
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Apr 24, 2015, at 6:33 AM, Phil Archer<phila@w3.org>  wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Eating some of my own dogfood...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Yaso asked me for comment on her work on the mental models in the glossary [1].
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I sent this suggested text:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> <h2>Data, Datasets, Metadata, Publishers and Re-Users</h2>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> <p>When discussing the publication and use of data on the Web, terms like data, dataset and metadata are commonplace. In a <em>specific context</em>, the differences between the terms can be clear. For example, if a CSV file contains a series of numerical values those values are the data, the totality of the data is the dataset and the column and row headings are the metadata. Again emphasizing the context, the simple 'metedata is data about data' definition works. But, to recycle a sentence from 1997:</p>
>>>>>>> <blockquote>The distinction between "data" and "metadata" is not an absolute one; it is a distinction created primarily by a particular application, and many times the same resource will be interpreted in both ways simultaneously.' [RDF-INTRO]</blockquote>
>>>>>>> <p>Imagine a system that scrapes the Web site of an online shop, adds extra pictures and details and then publishes the resulting information through an API. As far as the online shop is concerned, the original data is metadata about the products on sale, but to the person scraping the site, the metadata is now the data and the enriched data must now be described with new metadata as part of the API documentation. In this sequence, the data consumer becomes a data publisher too of course.</p>
>>>>>>> <p><strong>Therefore</strong>, in order to present a coherent set of best practices, the working group takes the view that the same artifacts (the same bytes), may be thought of as data in one context, metadata in another, or indeed both simultaneously. Any re-user may be a publisher, again, perhaps simultaneously. However, in context:</p>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Data...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Metadata...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "RDF-INTRO":{
>>>>>>>         "authors":["Ora Lassila"],
>>>>>>>         "href":"http://www.w3.org/TR/NOTE-rdf-simple-intro
>>>>>>>         "title":"Introduction to RDF Metadata",
>>>>>>>         "status":"Note",
>>>>>>>         "publisher":"W3C",
>>>>>>>         "date":"13 November 1997"
>>>>>>>        }
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> [1]http://yaso.is/dwbp/glossary.html
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -- 
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Phil Archer
>>>>>>> W3C Data Activity Lead
>>>>>>> http://www.w3.org/2013/data/
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://philarcher.org
>>>>>>> +44 (0)7887 767755
>>>>>>> @philarcher1
>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>