- From: CSS Meeting Bot via GitHub <sysbot+gh@w3.org>
- Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2022 17:03:18 +0000
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The CSS Working Group just discussed `order on table columns`. <details><summary>The full IRC log of that discussion</summary> <fantasai> Topic: order on table columns<br> <TabAtkins> ScribeNick: TabAtkins<br> <fantasai> github: https://github.com/w3c/csswg-drafts/issues/7340#issuecomment-1247390415<br> <iank_> I don't think this will take 5 mins<br> <TabAtkins> fremy: can summarize, maybe can't resolve<br> <TabAtkins> fremy: So we have some props that apply to grid-ish layout modes bu tnot tables<br> <TabAtkins> fremy: we discussed 'gap' earlier<br> <TabAtkins> fremy: But 'order', think it makes sense to be able to swap columns<br> <TabAtkins> fremy: Right now you have to change every single row to swap columns<br> <TabAtkins> fremy: So you'd bea ble to apply 'order' to columns and it will swap them around. Sounds reasonable, but raises some questions<br> <TabAtkins> fremy: column groups, spanning cells, etc<br> <TabAtkins> fremy: There's a concrete proposal - you glue together columns that are part of a column group or have spanning cells, and they can't be moved separately<br> <TabAtkins> fremy: Seems doable, but is it something we want to do?<br> <iank_> q+<br> <PaulG> q+<br> <Rossen_> ack masonf<br> <Rossen_> ack iank_<br> <TabAtkins> iank_: My concern - this sounds ok - but this is slightly special and new because it sin't how order works in the other properties<br> <TabAtkins> iank_: Like flex and grid, it just literally reorders the items as you lay them out<br> <TabAtkins> iank_: This has a second-order effet<br> <TabAtkins> iank_: So a littl emor complexity<br> <TabAtkins> iank_: Also want to spend more time thinking about how columns move when they're spanning<br> <Rossen_> ack PaulG<br> <TabAtkins> PaulG: Table semantics often ahve grid controls like arrow keys, focus groups, etc<br> <TabAtkins> PaulG: Reordering columns means devs also have to udnerstand the impact on those, and adjust<br> <TabAtkins> PaulG: Seems quite complex and fraught<br> <TabAtkins> PaulG: If it doesn't adjust, the arrow keys will jump columns and not match visual order<br> <TabAtkins> PaulG: If we adopt focus group controls, it'll get more complicated<br> <TabAtkins> fremy: Agree, but we're just talking about data tables. If you use for anything else you're doing wrong<br> <TabAtkins> fremy: But this is same for Flexbox generally, if you change the order you have to worry about keyboard order.<br> <Rossen_> Zakim, close queue<br> <Zakim> ok, Rossen_, the speaker queue is closed<br> <TabAtkins> fremy: But I do think this is a valid concern<br> <TabAtkins> fremy: I think if we assume it's just data tables it's ok<br> <TabAtkins> dbaron: In terms of column spans/groups, I think reordering in a way that doesn't break them is probably desirable<br> <TabAtkins> dbaron: But it's not especially clear ot me what you do to keep them together<br> <TabAtkins> dbaron: Can maybe be flusehd out in the issue<br> <TabAtkins> dbaron: Also concerned with same things as PaulG, whether there are *good* use-cases that justify the problematic with keyboard a11y<br> <TabAtkins> fantasai: Question really is not whether this is correct righ tnow, but if this is something we potentially care about at all. If we think it's bad we can just drop it.<br> <TabAtkins> fremy: Suggest we give everyone a week to think about it.<br> <TabAtkins> Rossen_: agreed<br> <fantasai> s/this is correct/this is ready to adopt/<br> </details> -- GitHub Notification of comment by css-meeting-bot Please view or discuss this issue at https://github.com/w3c/csswg-drafts/issues/7340#issuecomment-1276481544 using your GitHub account -- Sent via github-notify-ml as configured in https://github.com/w3c/github-notify-ml-config
Received on Wednesday, 12 October 2022 17:03:19 UTC