W3C home > Mailing lists > Public > public-css-archive@w3.org > December 2019

Re: [csswg-drafts] [css-lists] Are outside markers out-of-flow? (#4574)

From: Mats Palmgren via GitHub <sysbot+gh@w3.org>
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 2019 21:08:33 +0000
To: public-css-archive@w3.org
Message-ID: <issue_comment.created-565753363-1576357712-sysbot+gh@w3.org>
Introducing a new kind of out-of-flow is a fairly invasive change though. So I think there needs to be strong arguments for doing that.

So let's examine your use case again. The argument is that **not** underlining outside markers "looks better". But if you click the marker in your example it actually navigates, so I think removing the underline also removes semantic value for users (namely that it's part of the link).  I'm not sure I agree that aesthetics should trump semantics here. And if you think that it should, then why only outside markers? Surely inside markers would also look better without an underline, right?  But then the whole argument for making outside markers out-of-flow *for this reason* falls.  I think that if we want to support this use case then we should address it directly with something like `text-decoration-skip: markers` to let authors decide.  (In general, choices about aesthetics shouldn't be built-in in a way that authors can't override.)

Putting list items inside a link also seems like a rare use case. I'm guessing `text-decoration: line-through` is probably more common, e.g. to indicate that part of a document is obsolete/deleted or whatever.  In this case, it would feel wrong to me to not apply the text-decoration to the markers.

It's also worth noting that outside markers influence the first line's line-box size so it's not really out-of-flow in the sense that it doesn't affect the in-flow size either.

And as I said before, I'm opposed to changing the painting order in any way from what browsers are currently doing.  It's a very risky change to make from web-compat perspective and there's nothing to be gained by it. (That said, we could simply spec that they paint with in-flow boxes as before even if we decide to call them out-of-flow for other reasons.)

So far, I remain unconvinced that making outside markers out-of-flow is a good idea.  I think the arguments for keeping them in-flow are stronger.


-- 
GitHub Notification of comment by MatsPalmgren
Please view or discuss this issue at https://github.com/w3c/csswg-drafts/issues/4574#issuecomment-565753363 using your GitHub account
Received on Saturday, 14 December 2019 21:08:36 UTC

This archive was generated by hypermail 2.4.0 : Tuesday, 5 July 2022 06:41:57 UTC