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[MINUTES] W3C CCG Verifiable Credentials for Education Task Force Call - 2021-06-07 12pm ET

From: W3C CCG Chairs <w3c.ccg@gmail.com>
Date: Wed, 09 Jun 2021 18:26:16 -0700 (PDT)
Message-ID: <60c16a38.1c69fb81.a3727.38e6@mx.google.com>
Thanks to Kim Hamilton Duffy for scribing this week! The minutes
for this week's CCG Verifiable Credentials for Education Task Force telecon are now available:

https://w3c-ccg.github.io/meetings/2021-06-07-vc-education 

Full text of the discussion follows for W3C archival purposes.
Audio from the meeting is available as well (link provided below).

----------------------------------------------------------------
CCG Verifiable Credentials for Education Task Force Telecon Minutes for 2021-06-07

Agenda:
  undefined
Topics:
  1. Introductions & Reintroductions
  2. Announcements & Reminders
  3. Switch to Jitsi
  4. Open Credential Publisher and holder-to-holder use cases
  5. Open Badge Assertions and Verifiable Credential Assertions
Resolutions:
  1. Switching to jitsi on upcoming call
Organizer:
  Kim Hamilton Duffy and Kerri Lemoie and Anthony Camilleri
Scribe:
  Kim Hamilton Duffy
Present:
  Kim Hamilton Duffy, Taylor Kendall, Phil Long, Eric Kuhn, Jim 
  Goodell, Nate Otto, Keith Kowal, Kerri Lemoie
Audio:
  https://w3c-ccg.github.io/meetings/2021-06-07/audio.ogg

Kim Hamilton Duffy: Agenda: TODO
Kim Hamilton Duffy is scribing.
https://www.w3.org/community/credentials/join
https://www.w3.org/community/about/agreements/cla/
https://w3c-ccg.github.io/meetings/

Topic: Introductions & Reintroductions

Jarlath_O'Carroll
Eric_Kuhn, Microsoft Decentralized ID, K-12, Microsoft EDU team 
  on integrated

Topic: Announcements & Reminders

Taylor Kendall: June 15-17 - 
  https://uto.asu.edu/events/digital-trust-summit
<jarlath o'carroll> @Eric is that session recorded and published 
  somewhere?
<phil-t3> Thanks @Taylor
<anthony_camilleri> One more, OECD is doing a digital education 
  policy conference starting tomorrow. Free registration:
Eric Kuhn: Looks like their youtube channel only had the main 
  stage recorded https://www.youtube.com/c/BitcoinMagazine/videos
<jarlath o'carroll> OK @Eric - thanks, would have liked to have 
  seen/heard it
Jim Goodell: Register to participate in the June T3 Network 
  Charter Review sessions at: https://bit.ly/3owPmBy
Jim Goodell: Officially JOIN the T3 Innovation Network through 
  the T3 Network Resource Hub at: T3Networkhub.org

Topic: Switch to Jitsi

RESOLUTION: Switching to jitsi on upcoming call

Topic: Open Credential Publisher and holder-to-holder use cases

https://github.com/w3c-ccg/vc-ed-use-cases/issues/1
Can we join any of the vc-http-api use cases?

Topic: Open Badge Assertions and Verifiable Credential Assertions

https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1Oj0Gmqp0d_hVfRLmMOGIxOOVmwAV2lcTo04qyNxwiqM/edit#slide=id.p
Nate Otto:  What does a validator need to know:
1. Id from recipient, and validate
2. Id from issuer and validate, can I trust?
3. Does it recopgnize some kind of skill that's recognized in my 
  system
4. Timely (expired)
5. Richness of badge meatdata
Keith Kowal:  Why putting open badges in VCs? are they inteded 
  for public consumption?
https://github.com/w3c-ccg/vc-ed-use-cases/issues/1
Phil Long: Direct link to Join the T3 Innovation Network 
  https://app.t3networkhub.org/   - no cost and pre-req to get the 
  invite to the open meetings for reviewing the new network 
  charters.
https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1Oj0Gmqp0d_hVfRLmMOGIxOOVmwAV2lcTo04qyNxwiqM/edit#slide=id.p
Kerri Lemoie: Example Open Badges 2.0 Assertion: 
  https://hackmd.io/dqzBT2URTYiWS00OY6MbuQ?view
Nate Otto: IMS Global Open Badges 2.0 Specification: 
  https://www.imsglobal.org/sites/default/files/Badges/OBv2p0Final/index.html
Nate Otto: Example Open Badges with VC Assertion: 
  https://hackmd.io/2PgmvWQlSeeCwi1mWFA5Eg?both
Nate Otto: W3C Verifiable Credentials Data Model: 
  https://www.w3.org/TR/vc-data-model/
<brent_shambaugh> yes
<phil-t3> Is everyone clear on what Kerri means by a ‘baked 
  badge’?
<eric_kuhn> no
<phil-t3> @Eric - the image of the badge has the actual data for 
  the image embedded in the image itsellf.
Nate Otto: A "Baked badge" is a PNG or SVG image file that has 
  the open badges metadata in it according to the OB Baking Spec 
  https://openbadgespec.org/baking
<ottonomy> For PNG and SVG there is a specific protocol for 
  embedding this metadata in that file. The validator can then pull 
  that data out of the file so your badge data can travel with you 
  between file systems.
Nate Otto: There are libraries in multiple languages. I maintain 
  one in python for instance (openbadges_bakery). It's a pretty 
  simple operation on top of a PNG chunk editor library or XML 
  library. -- like 100 lines of code or so in the "bakery" layer. 
  https://pypi.org/project/openbadges-bakery/
Nate Otto: Any role *could* bake a badge, but typically the 
  issuer does so in order to deliver it to the recipient/subject. 
  Validation can start from a file (e.g. https://badgecheck.io ) -- 
  the validator begins by extracting the assertion data from the 
  PNG or SVG.
I hoped Nate would use the term interloper
<anthony-camilleri> I am missing badgeclass from the slides. 
  Where has it gone?
Nate Otto: I think hasCredential should be direct to a badge, not 
  hasCredential: { badge: {} }
<anthony-camilleri> strongly agree with self-contained.
<david_ward> Being self-contained probably also means that the 
  badge class also needs to be embedded.
<anthony-camilleri> I tend to think of the badgeclass in a VC 
  context as an externally hosted template, which then is written 
  entirely into the credential.
Phil Long: +1 @Anthony and @Eric on there is no dependence on the 
  issuer being contacted for the verification to be done.
Nate Otto: On baking: there's no need for baking in the VC 
  ecosystem, but if any issuers wanted to use that method for data 
  flows where users download as a file and upload to another open 
  badges app as a file, it could easily be done. But if we can pull 
  off good interoperability just within VC protocols for 
  connections between issuers, wallets and verifiers, it would be 
  great to stay in that realm.
<eric_kuhn> spot on Keith
<anthony-camilleri> @nate: I actually think we need to evolve the 
  concept of baking in the VC context. Allowing the Issuer to 
  specify displayproperties/visual representation rules for 
  credentials is an essential part of many use cases. But maybe we 
  should be able to bake to a variety of 
  screensizes/formats/platforms depending on use case.
<jim_goodell> I need to jump. Great conversation!
<phil-t3> I like the idea of enabling the giving the holder the 
  opportunity to decide what they want to share on any …’portal’… 
  site of their choice, but the richer data that is hoped provides 
  greater clarity about what the learner knows and can do something 
  the individual presents
<phil-t3> That is ‘presents’ in the VC sense.
<ottonomy> That said... As Kerri is mentioning the VC .id 
  property could be a hosted and shareable HTTP URL that represents 
  the badge as opposed to using a learner-controlled presentation 
  service.
<anthony-camilleri> within VC logic, isn't any share supposed to 
  be a VP, including a public share?
<anthony-camilleri> or do I have a misconception here?
<ottonomy> I think issuer sharing of the VC directly would be 
  indeed thought by some to be an anti-pattern.
<eric_kuhn> sharing from a user to an RP uses a VP
Kim Hamilton Duffy: +1 Kerri
<ottonomy> At some point, probably in a future call, if we want 
  to address it directly, Keith's other point that "VC attributes 
  could solve for" a bunch of use cases that we are thinking about 
  using this Defined Achievement claim for..
<phil-t3> @Anthony - great question. At the present time a VC is 
  intended to be a direct to the RP exchange, as Eric notes, with 
  the added feature of progressive disclosure up to simply saying 
  yes or no to the presence of an attribute (a ZKP approach).
<ottonomy> Having a claim schema that is actually implemented in 
  an ecosystem where issuers are using it and verifiers are 
  consuming it for some kind of business value is the real prize. 
  That is better than having bespoke claim type attributes for each 
  possible credential that could be issued.
<phil-t3> One of the challenges we’re encountering is the notion 
  of a layer of publicly shareable data vs. data that is private 
  (it may contain PII, or could lead to identity discovery, etc.)
<david_ward> The ability to use an Open Badges "backpack" as a 
  publicly sharable "resume" can be useful to people.
Keith Kowal: +1
<eric_kuhn> David, another option is using the concept of an 
  Identity Hub and including your VCs in your hub that other users 
  could query to see your 'resume' or public profile
<kate_giovacchini> Thanks all! An interesting conversation as 
  always!
<kerri_lemoie> klemoie@concentricsky.com
<phil-t3> Cheers!
Received on Thursday, 10 June 2021 01:26:43 UTC

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