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RE: looking for help with/guidance for a schema.org proposal

From: Siegman, Tzviya <tsiegman@wiley.com>
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2020 14:21:07 +0000
To: Jarno van Driel <jarnovandriel@gmail.com>, Leonard Rosenthol <lrosenth@adobe.com>
CC: "public-credentials@w3.org" <public-credentials@w3.org>
Message-ID: <BL0PR02MB4820E301F4B5F85EAAAD2972D5EE0@BL0PR02MB4820.namprd02.prod.outlook.com>
I am also involved in ISCC and have done some work with schema.org. I have not been very involved in CCG, but I can do some homework. If there is interest in discussing ISCC with the authors, I suspect they would be more than happy to join the group as guests for a session.

Tzviya Siegman
Information Standards Principal
Wiley
201-748-6884
tsiegman@wiley.com<mailto:tsiegman@wiley.com>

From: Jarno van Driel <jarnovandriel@gmail.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 5, 2020 9:18 AM
To: Leonard Rosenthol <lrosenth@adobe.com>
Cc: public-credentials@w3.org
Subject: Re: looking for help with/guidance for a schema.org proposal

⛔
This is an external email.
Thanks for those resources Leonard. I'll definitely look into them over the next couple of days.

Op do 5 nov. 2020 om 15:11 schreef Leonard Rosenthol <lrosenth@adobe.com<mailto:lrosenth@adobe.com>>:
Jarno – sounds like you should check out the work of the Content Authenticity Initiative (https://contentauthenticity.org/) which provides all the infrastructure for doing this including cryptographic timestamping and aligning with Schema.org for metadata entries (what we call Assertions).   And these Claims or their hashes can be stored on a DLT/blockchain should you desire.  The other standard in development that you should also investigate is the ISCC (https://iscc.codes/) which is currently undergoing review and standardization at the ISO.

Happy to discuss either/both projects with you…

Leonard

From: Jarno van Driel <jarnovandriel@gmail.com<mailto:jarnovandriel@gmail.com>>
Date: Thursday, November 5, 2020 at 8:08 AM
To: "public-credentials@w3.org<mailto:public-credentials@w3.org>" <public-credentials@w3.org<mailto:public-credentials@w3.org>>
Subject: looking for help with/guidance for a schema.org<http://schema.org> proposal
Resent-From: <public-credentials@w3.org<mailto:public-credentials@w3.org>>
Resent-Date: Thursday, November 5, 2020 at 8:06 AM

Hi folks,

I'm one of the editors of a recent schema.org<https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fschema.org%2F&data=04%7C01%7Clrosenth%40adobe.com%7Ce91f3846bda14226492f08d8818be1a9%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C637401785073129039%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=TNwNbFGs6%2BDlWSqkD%2FgH5NDdtGy8p8KOXfcVHLr9sGk%3D&reserved=0> proposal for time-stamping content via blockchain<https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgithub.com%2Fschemaorg%2Fschemaorg%2Fissues%2F2756&data=04%7C01%7Clrosenth%40adobe.com%7Ce91f3846bda14226492f08d8818be1a9%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C637401785073139028%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=BXVzbYPUQAK%2F67RJCJ%2B4Hy3mXKfXf3jmG4lkXoT9%2BKI%3D&reserved=0> and am hoping you can provide us (the authors of the proposal) with some help/guidance as to how this proposal might be realized such that it:

  *   allows everyday publishers to publish markup to:

     *   timestamp their content in a 'simple' yet verifiable manner
     *   optionally provide the content used (a Key) for generating a transaction hash
     *   optionally provide the content used for generating a transaction hash of previous editions of the content (via a Key that refers to its previous edition)

  *   doesn't conflict with the (enormous) amount of work this group has already done
Prior to posting the schema.org<https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fschema.org%2F&data=04%7C01%7Clrosenth%40adobe.com%7Ce91f3846bda14226492f08d8818be1a9%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C637401785073149020%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=D89avYfFkwwX3cls3HsVVmvJhp%2BtP61%2B2DeVXpychZE%3D&reserved=0> proposal Manu Sporny was so kind to provide us with some resources that he recommended we should read (about merkle-proof, opentimestamps, chainpoint and hash-links) though after we posted the proposal it became clear we hadn't succeeded in preventing conflicts with MerkleProof2019 (and possibly also with other parts of the work this group has done).

So over the last 4-5 days I've taken a real deep dive into the Security Vocabulary<https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fw3c-ccg.github.io%2Fsecurity-vocab%2F&data=04%7C01%7Clrosenth%40adobe.com%7Ce91f3846bda14226492f08d8818be1a9%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C637401785073149020%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=l%2Bl%2B8SeO1FDkdndfTVBvrY12RfrNMIylSuDHIps9Tsk%3D&reserved=0> only to end up feeling completely overwhelmed by it and subsequently have come to a halt in working on our schema.org<https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fschema.org%2F&data=04%7C01%7Clrosenth%40adobe.com%7Ce91f3846bda14226492f08d8818be1a9%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C637401785073159016%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=8Gs%2BDCnYUBWPUgRp0aq1lDxyfqocRNI4HE9%2BVM9SxcA%3D&reserved=0> proposal as I realized we won't be able to get this done without your input (because we're set on not getting into conflict with your drafts).

The (maybe naive) objective of our proposal is to provide publishers with an 'easy' solution to achieve the objectives I mentioned above and as such provide validators with the minimum data they need (entry-points so to say) to be to validate the timestamps (by getting the rest of the information they need elsewhere).

Any help would be greatly appreciated!

--

The markup model for time-stamping content we've come up with thus far looks like this:
{
  "@context":"https://schema.org<https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fschema.org%2F&data=04%7C01%7Clrosenth%40adobe.com%7Ce91f3846bda14226492f08d8818be1a9%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C637401785073159016%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=AlKW83tqALI9PuttYfvPJFCVM%2F6TgOguJ%2BzE9dQKEYg%3D&reserved=0>",
  "@type":"Article",
  "name":"A time-stamped article",
  "mainEntityOfPage":"https://example.com/time-stamped-article/<https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fexample.com%2Ftime-stamped-article%2F&data=04%7C01%7Clrosenth%40adobe.com%7Ce91f3846bda14226492f08d8818be1a9%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C637401785073169013%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=ppvEnIZZ3aWDjQCNzbJnB7BR53nyqQGdoANvl2ZW%2BGY%3D&reserved=0>",
  "timestamp":
  {
    "@type":"BlockchainTransaction",
    "identifier":"0fce9c929ef03838775703d4cf55b7b1bdd6a5cc3503a2606dbe3b6c0cf0a802",
    "hash":"8A258E516081C36B866812E49495628CBDC1DD4126DB321A28AE95EE55B83BAB",
    "hashingKey":"https://example.com/json/?key=8A258E516081C36B866812E49495628CBDC1DD4126DB321A28AE95EE55B83BAB<https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fexample.com%2Fjson%2F%3Fkey%3D8A258E516081C36B866812E49495628CBDC1DD4126DB321A28AE95EE55B83BAB&data=04%7C01%7Clrosenth%40adobe.com%7Ce91f3846bda14226492f08d8818be1a9%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C637401785073169013%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=vKv5OVnsVVaxIng1t9TXAQ2OcqqnHVCsKEO7mXrhI10%3D&reserved=0>",
    "isPartOf":
    {
      "@type":"BlockchainBlock",
      "identifier":"058ca16036c058217753b01200118f3ed92bfb2cee9a6c75bdb7bb1d110a767e",
      "blockHeight":3456789
    },
    "recordedIn":
    {
      "@type":"Blockchain",
      "name":"eos",
      "network":"mainnet",
      "identifier":"aca376f206b8fc25a6ed44dbdc66547c36c6c33e3a119ffbeaef943642f0e906"
    }
  }
}

The markup model for the Key looks like this:
{
  "@context":"https://schema.org<https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fschema.org%2F&data=04%7C01%7Clrosenth%40adobe.com%7Ce91f3846bda14226492f08d8818be1a9%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C637401785073179007%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=jM4liJrrfkIxGlIZ2rRaIPRsJdklcKiHga%2BMUVM%2FtgU%3D&reserved=0>",
  "@type":"Key",
  "dateCreated":"2020-09-27T20:28:41+01:00",
  "isBasedOn":"https://example.com/time-stamped-article/<https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fexample.com%2Ftime-stamped-article%2F&data=04%7C01%7Clrosenth%40adobe.com%7Ce91f3846bda14226492f08d8818be1a9%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C637401785073179007%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=Vfq7%2BpFF49Zn%2FmpUV70gXwvqHzh4Lw%2BH0aq%2FJRSCEDM%3D&reserved=0>",
  "encodingAlgorithm":"SHA-256",
  "encodingFormat":"text/html"
  "text":"<h1>Nunc eget lorem dolor sed</h1>\t\t\n\t\t\t<h2>Suspendisse sed nisi lacus sed viverra tellus.</h2>\t\t\n\t\t\t<p>Non consectetur a erat nam at lectus urna. Ut porttitor leo a diam sollicitudin tempor id eu.</p>..."
}
Received on Thursday, 5 November 2020 14:21:28 UTC

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