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RE: Techniques for WCAG 2.0 H45 longdesc: User agent support ( LC-2792)

From: Andrew Kirkpatrick <akirkpat@adobe.com>
Date: Mon, 30 Sep 2013 11:17:10 -0700
To: Laura Carlson <laura.lee.carlson@gmail.com>
CC: "public-comments-wcag20@w3.org" <public-comments-wcag20@w3.org>, Charles McCathieNevile <w3b@chaals.com>, Dominic Mazzoni <dmazzoni@chromium.org>, Joshue O Connor <joshue.oconnor@cfit.ie>, John Foliot <john@foliot.ca>
Message-ID: <EE43A638A0C5E34E80AF78EFE940FC2C10C200B318@nambx09.corp.adobe.com>
Ah, ok, I misunderstood.  We'll have to queue it up for the next release, as I don't think (I'm new at this so I could be wrong, I'll check) that we can easily make that sort of editorial change on its own.  

Thanks,
AWK

Andrew Kirkpatrick
Group Product Manager, Accessibility
Adobe Systems 

akirkpat@adobe.com
http://twitter.com/awkawk

http://blogs.adobe.com/accessibility



-----Original Message-----
From: Laura Carlson [mailto:laura.lee.carlson@gmail.com] 
Sent: Monday, September 30, 2013 2:05 PM
To: Andrew Kirkpatrick
Cc: public-comments-wcag20@w3.org; Charles McCathieNevile; Dominic Mazzoni; Joshue O Connor; John Foliot
Subject: Re: Techniques for WCAG 2.0 H45 longdesc: User agent support ( LC-2792)

Hi Andrew,

longdesc in Chromevox has been a reality for some time now. It isn't planed is is real.  Please check previous message. Can that be added now?

What I was asking Dominic about was his direct implementation in Chrome via context menu.

Thanks.

Best Regards,
Laura

On 9/30/13, Andrew Kirkpatrick <akirkpat@adobe.com> wrote:
> Thanks Laura.  We've got some time before the next release of the 
> techniques, so it will be easy to remove the "planned" re: ChromeVox's 
> implementation when it is complete and have it be part of the new 
> techniques update.
>
> We're also reviewing comments from John related to this.
>
> Thanks,
> AWK
>
> Andrew Kirkpatrick
> Group Product Manager, Accessibility
> Adobe Systems
>
> akirkpat@adobe.com
> http://twitter.com/awkawk

> http://blogs.adobe.com/accessibility

>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Laura Carlson [mailto:laura.lee.carlson@gmail.com]
> Sent: Monday, September 30, 2013 1:52 PM
> To: public-comments-wcag20@w3.org; Charles McCathieNevile; Dominic 
> Mazzoni
> Cc: Joshue O Connor; Andrew Kirkpatrick; John Foliot
> Subject: Re: Techniques for WCAG 2.0 H45 longdesc: User agent support 
> (
> LC-2792)
>
> Dear WCAG WG,
>
> + Dominic Mazzoni
>
> Thank you very much for revising "H45 Using longdesc"'s UA section. To 
> the best of my knowledge your new proposed text [1] for H45 is 
> accurate. Chaals, do you concur?
>
> One screen reader that is missing is ChromeVox. It has longdesc support.
>
> Dominic, in July you had uploaded an initial draft Chrome 
> implementation for longdesc. [1] What is the ETA of longdesc landing 
> in Chrome? Perhaps the word "planned" can be removed from the phrase 
> "Chrome (planned)" in WCAG 2.0 Technique H45: Using longdesc.
>
> Best Regards,
> Laura
>
> [1] "User Agent support for longdesc varies, but overall support is 
> improving. Screen readers such as JAWS, NVDA, and Window-Eyes support 
> longdesc, but Voiceover 4.0, Orca 2.32.0, and screen magnifier 
> Zoomtext 10.0 do not yet support the longdesc attribute. Browsers 
> including Internet Explorer, Firefox, Opera, and Chrome (planned) all support longdesc."
> http://www.w3.org/TR/2013/NOTE-WCAG20-TECHS-20130905/H45.html#ua2.19.1

> [2] http://code.google.com/p/chromium/issues/detail?id=224285#c26

>
> On 9/22/13, akirkpat@adobe.com <akirkpat@adobe.com> wrote:
>>  Dear Laura Carlson ,
>>
>> The Web Content Accessibility Guidelines Working Group has reviewed 
>> the comments you sent [1] on the Last Call Working Draft [2] of the 
>> Techniques for WCAG 2.0 published on 11 Jul 2013. Thank you for 
>> having taken the time to review the document and to send us comments!
>>
>> The Working Group's response to your comment is included below.
>>
>> Please review it carefully and let us know by email at 
>> public-comments-wcag20@w3.org if you agree with it or not before 2 
>> Oct 2013. In case of disagreement, you are requested to provide a 
>> specific solution for or a path to a consensus with the Working 
>> Group. If such a consensus cannot be achieved, you will be given the 
>> opportunity to raise a formal objection which will then be reviewed 
>> by the Director during the transition of this document to the next 
>> stage in the W3C Recommendation Track.
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> For the Web Content Accessibility Guidelines Working Group, Michael 
>> Cooper W3C Staff Contact
>>
>>  1.
>> http://www.w3.org/mid/CAOavpveFp6GsrEBFik9je+6b=KYpd0mBk0n-Hngz=Dg1Py

>> o
>> 2mA@mail.gmail.com  2.
>> http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/2013/WD-WCAG20-TECHS-20130711/

>>
>>
>> =====
>>
>> Your comment on H45: Using longdesc:
>>> 1. Title of the document
>>>
>>> Techniques for WCAG 2.0 H45 longdesc
>>>
>>> 2. Location within the document
>>>
>>> "User Agent and Assistive Technology Support Notes"
>>> http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/2013/WD-WCAG20-TECHS-20130711/H45.html#ua2.

>>> 1
>>> 9.1
>>>
>>> 3. Concern
>>>
>>> User Agent support for longdesc varies, but overall support is 
>>> improving. The Techniques for WCAG 2.0 document should say that, as 
>>> it does for ARIA. H45 should provide a full listing of support. 
>>> There is now new and improved validator support and more widespread 
>>> implementation (e.g. in Chrome Vox, NVDA, Firefox). This will lead 
>>> authors to make fewer errors and users to experience longdesc.
>>>
>>> 4. Suggested change
>>>
>>> Please state that:
>>>
>>> User Agent support for longdesc varies, but overall support is 
>>> improving. A collection of tools that provide support for longdesc 
>>> exists.
>>>
>>> And provide a full listing of support:
>>>
>>> BROWSERS
>>>
>>> Opera, Firefox, Chromium, and Internet Explorer all support longdesc 
>>> DOM reflection.
>>> http://people.opera.com/philipj/2011/01/23/longdesc/

>>>
>>> * As of Mozilla 25 Firefox has native support via the image context 
>>> menu.
>>> http://www.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/

>>> https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=877453

>>> Firefox has accessibility API support.
>>>
>> https://mxr.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/source/accessible/src/html/ns

>> H
>> TMLImageAccessible.cpp
>>> Support for prior versions is supplied via:
>>>   * Longdesc Firefox Extension by Patrick H. Lauke, adds a "View 
>>> Image Longdesc" option to the image context menu that activates the 
>>> link to the long description.
>>> https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/longdesc/

>>>   * Longdesk 0.2 FireFox Extension by Anthony Ricaud, adds a link to 
>>> the longdesc under images that provides one.
>>> https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/longdesk/

>>>
>>> * It is anticipated that Chrome will be providing native support.
>>> "Now that the spec has been published I think we can add it." - 
>>> Dominic Mazzoni
>>>
>> http://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/group/chromium-accessibility/

>> b rowse_thread/thread/6542ed13863a8f2c#
>>> Support for prior versions of Chrome is supplied via Longdesc plugin 
>>> by Chris Kennish, which "highlights and provides right-click access 
>>> to image long descriptions, where provided."
>>>
>> https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/longdesc/haohljalgapbacpkfe

>> f
>> nmhiadanhejmb
>>>
>>> * iCab has native support of longdesc via a context-menu.
>>> http://www.icab.de/

>>>
>>> * Opera 1010b1 to Blink has native support of longdesc. Exposition 
>>> of the longdesc is exposed by a right click on the image for which 
>>> the longdesc has been defined.
>>> http://www.opera.com/docs/changelogs/mac/1010b1/#ui

>>> Support for prior versions of Opera is supplied via:
>>>   * TellMeMore Opera extension, which respects a web page's visual 
>>> design yet provides critical functionality. It will "Find things 
>>> that have more description available, and show them on demand. Where 
>>> images (or something else) have a longdesc attribute, the extension 
>>> notifies by changing its icon and title, and enables the user to see 
>>> a list of the descriptions available, in its popup. When the user 
>>> selects an item in the popup, a new window opens with the 
>>> description in it."
>>> https://addons.opera.com/en/extensions/details/tellmemore/

>>>
>>> * Internet Explorer (IE)
>>>   * When used together with assistive technology such as Jaws, IE 
>>> makes longdesc accessible to the AT user.
>>>   * Configuring Internet Explorer to Handle Longdesc - Adds a 
>>> context menu entry to extract the longdesc attribute value and have 
>>> the page navigate to its content for sighted users. by Sean Hayes.
>>>
>> http://blogs.msdn.com/b/accessibility/archive/2011/03/25/configuring-

>> i nternet-explorer-to-handle-longdesc.aspx
>>>   * Longdesc Linker for Internet Explorer 6 - Browser Helper Object 
>>> which adds a "Long Description" item to the context menu that IE 
>>> uses for images.
>>> http://www.hackcraft.net/longdesclink/

>>>
>>> * Netscape 7.0 (rv:1.0.1 Gecko/20020823) supports the longdesc 
>>> attribute via the context menu.
>>>
>>> * Home Page Reader has native support of longdesc and is still used 
>>> in Japan for longdesc, even though it stopped being maintained years 
>>> ago.
>>>
>>> * Long Description Favelet "announces the number of images with 
>>> longdesc attributes and provides links to the long description file 
>>> in each case." by James W. Thatcher. It works ubiquitously in 
>>> Chrome, FireFox, Internet Explorer, Safari, Opera, and iCab.
>>> http://jimthatcher.com/favelets/

>>>
>>>
>>> ASSISTIVE TECHNOLOGY
>>>
>>> The following assistive technology informs users that an image has a 
>>> long description, at which point the user has the option of reading 
>>> the description or skipping it.
>>>
>>> * Chromevox began supporting longdesc in version 1.26. It is 
>>> announced and can be activated with Cvox + C > D 
>>> http://www.chromevox.com/release_notes.html

>>>
>>> * NVDA will now announce the existence of the long description, and 
>>> a user can press NVDA+d to open it.
>>> http://community.nvda-project.org/ticket/809#comment:5

>>>
>>> * JAWS Version 4.01 and up supports longdesc.
>>> http://www.freedomscientific.com/fs_products/software_jaws401newfea.

>>> a
>>> sp
>>>
>>> * Adaptive Multimedia Information System (AMIS) 
>>> http://www.daisy.org/projects/amis

>>>
>>> * AnyDaisy FF Extension
>>> https://launchpad.net/daisyextension

>>>
>>> * LookOUT in combination with WebbIE.
>>> http://www.screenreader.net/

>>>
>>> * Sense Reader Professional Edition v1.1.0.6 (KoreChromeVoxan)
>>> http://www.haeppa.kr/?page=10

>>>
>>> * SuperNova/Hal
>>> http://www.yourdolphin.com/

>>>
>>> * Thunder in combination with WebbIE.
>>> http://www.screenreader.co.uk/product.php?shopprodid=1

>>>
>>> * Window-Eyes
>>> http://www.gwmicro.com/Window-Eyes/Manual/HTML/advanced.html

>>>
>>> * Home Page Reader has native support of longdesc and is still used 
>>> in Japan for longdesc.
>>>
>>>
>>> AUTHORING TOOLS
>>>
>>> The following authoring tools support the longdesc attribute.
>>>
>>> * AChecker
>>> * AD Gallery
>>> * Alt Text Checker
>>> * Amaya
>>> * A-Prompt
>>> * ASP.NET
>>> * BlueGriffon
>>> * CKEditor
>>> * Connexions Markup Language (CNXML)
>>> * Cute Editor
>>> * Docbook Docbook XSL Documentation (html.longdesc)
>>> * Docbook XSL Documentation (html.longdesc.link)
>>> * Dreamweaver, Creative Suite
>>> * Drupal 7 - Drupal 7 Release Date, January 5, 2011.
>>> * easyALBUM
>>> * elRTE
>>> * Expression Studio
>>> * Expression Web
>>> * gp|Easy CMS
>>> * HERA
>>> * iGraph-Lite
>>> * Juicy Studio's Image Analyser
>>> * jQuery Accessible Longdesc Plugin
>>> * LongDesc Page Generator
>>> * ObjectDescription
>>> * Oxygen XML Editor
>>> * RadEditor for ASP.NET AJAX
>>> * Save As DAISY/MSWord Add-In
>>> * simplepie
>>> * SiteVision.se (CMS)
>>> * TinyMCE
>>> * WAVE
>>> * Weblight
>>> * WordPress longdesc Plugin Automatic longdesc to be added to 
>>> WordPress
>>> * Visual Studio and ASP.NET
>>> * XStandard
>>> http://www.d.umn.edu/~lcarlson/research/ld-ua.html#atools

>>>
>>> 4. Additional rationale for the comment
>>>
>>> The Techniques for WCAG 2.0 document should treat ARIA and longdesc 
>>> equitably.
>>>
>>> ARIA Techniques for WCAG 2.0 is cast in a positive light: "User 
>>> Agent support for WAI-ARIA varies, but overall support for WAI-ARIA 
>>> is improving."
>>>
>> http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/2013/WD-WCAG20-TECHS-20130711/#wai-aria_ua_s

>> u
>> pport
>>>
>>> In contrast H45: Using longdesc is cast in a negative light:
>>> "Voiceover 4.0, NVDA 2012, Orca 2.32.0, and Zoomtext 10.0 (and their 
>>> earlier versions) do not support the longdesc attribute. Versions of 
>>> JAWS earlier than JAWS 4.01 and versions of WindowEyes earlier than 
>>> WindowEyes 4.5 do not support this attribute, but later versions do."
>>> http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/2013/WD-WCAG20-TECHS-20130711/H45.html

>>> There is no mention of longdesc improving i.e., NVDA, Chromevox, 
>>> Firefox, the many extensions.
>>>
>>> Please correct this situation.
>>
>>
>> Working Group Resolution (LC-2792):
>> Thanks for your comment and suggested text. This information is 
>> useful, and will be incorporated into the 'User Agent and Assistive 
>> Technology Support Notes' found on
>> http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/2013/WD-WCAG20-TECHS-20130711/H45.html#ua2.1

>> 9
>> .1 to
>> read:
>>
>> [DONE] User Agent support for longdesc varies, but overall support is 
>> improving. Screen readers such as JAWS, NVDA, and Window-Eyes support 
>> longdesc, but Voiceover 4.0, Orca 2.32.0, and screen magnifier 
>> Zoomtext
>> 10.0 do not yet support the longdesc attribute. Browsers including 
>> Internet Explorer, Firefox, Opera, and Chrome (planned) all support 
>> longdesc.
>>
>> ----
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Laura L. Carlson
>


--
Laura L. Carlson
Received on Monday, 30 September 2013 18:17:46 UTC

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