W3C home > Mailing lists > Public > public-bpwg@w3.org > November 2005

RE: some thoughts on current state of bp draft

From: Scheppe, Kai-Dietrich <k.scheppe@t-online.net>
Date: Mon, 21 Nov 2005 09:00:51 +0100
Message-ID: <398533C370C23441981074C456AA3BDD2C2400@QEO00226.de.t-online.corp>
To: <public-bpwg@w3.org>
Hi Tom,
Thanks for thoughts on the document.
You are correct in your observation, that the document is kept simple.
Perhaps too simple, but that needs to be reexamined. 
In general though, we are dealing with changing the way content authors
think about creating web pages on a very basic level, simply because the
patterns of doing so are very ingrained and are heavily tilted towards
desktop clients.
However, people who are obviously already involved deeply in the
conflicts surrounding the creation of mobile specialized web sites are
already aware of many of those problems.
I think that they may not be our target group though.  Why?  Because we
are not attempting on making mobile sites better, but making the
everyday site mobile capable.
Your specific points about the document need to be addressed
individually within the group, because perhaps we are failing to
communicate something here.
Best regards,


	From: public-bpwg-request@w3.org
[mailto:public-bpwg-request@w3.org] On Behalf Of Tom Thurston
	Sent: Saturday, November 19, 2005 9:34 AM
	To: public-bpwg@w3.org
	Subject: some thoughts on current state of bp draft
	Dear BPWG,
	I have read the recent draft of your document. Thank you for
taking the time to write it. May I offer the following observations?
	1. The document tries to get readers to subscribe to the concept
of putting information on links to let the user know how what content
follows. I read the document with the expectation that it was going to
fill me with insight about how to make a mobile website. Upon reading it
I felt that it was akin to some kind of MobileWebDevelopment 101 course,
and thus, with an associated enlightenment factor of 0, felt somewhat
cheated, as it took a long time to read. It was the same dissappointment
that I experienced on first reading the word
'flockynockynihiliphilification' only to discover that the word meant
'nothing'. Thus, if you are planning on writing a document for mobile
novices, then please label this clearly at the top of the document. If
you are going to follow your own advice on links, then you might want
every link to the document to say for example, "a 100,000 word document
describing ideas for how to build  a mobile website for the first time -
containing some good  - some bad - some really basic - and some
conflicting ideas".
	2. One example of a basic concept was telling people that they
should try and do adaptation on the server, rather than on the device.
Now I know that if you're a novice reading a document, it's sometimes
nice to come accross a really simple concept, as it gives you confidence
that you understand what you are reading. I love simple concepts, in
fact, I can only understand simple concepts. However, I feel that if
there is anybody out there who without reading the Mobile best practices
document, would be taking, a 1MegaByte image, and sending it to a mobile
device with the intention that the device will transcode it down to a
128x128 wallpaper... then that person should perhaps not be trying to
make any kind of website. I mean the document mentions lowest common
denominators... it omits some basic advice, such as 'turn on your
computer before you start typing'... I believe that you can get away
without having to emphasize that transcoding on a server is better than
transcoding on a device, for say images / video and sounds.
	3. One example of a wrong concept was telling people to never
use an image in place of text. I think that if companies making mobile
wap sites told their customers... "oh no don't bother making a logo
banner - we'll just use text"... they wouldn't have that customer for
very long. In my experience, customers don't want to see any text in
menus... they want nice good looking buttons which make good looking
websites... Our job is to get those buttons down to a size where they
look good, but don't exceed the pageweight for the device. So maybe you
want to recommend that people use thin (small height) banners...
especially if you are adapting to fill the device screen width, that is,
if they are going to take the risk and use an image instead of text...
	4. Were you trying to suggest that we should remove whitespace
from documents post editing or just to write all xml documents on one
line? Assuming the former is the intention, then this would mean that
you'd have to have some kind of xslt stylesheet to remove it during a
production build. Obviously, its not too hard to make one but if you're
aiming your document at novices, then you don't want to even let them
have a hint that there exists such thing as xslt, it'll put them right
off before they have even made their 'helloworld' mobile webapp.
	5. I didn't get the bit about a graphical / textual sitemap. In
my opinion, a mobile website should be its own site map. It should be
very clear where each bit of the main menu will take you...
	With kind regards,
Tom Thurston

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Received on Monday, 21 November 2005 09:01:00 UTC

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