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Re: VSS instantiation discussion

From: Ulf Bjorkengren <ulfbjorkengren@geotab.com>
Date: Wed, 8 Jul 2020 13:42:09 +0200
Message-ID: <CAHfMbK8NQXv3dytryAk91oZ8JADWJOiHUi8APYUBcZphDffOYg@mail.gmail.com>
To: "Schildt Sebastian (CR/ADT1)" <Sebastian.Schildt@de.bosch.com>
Cc: public-automotive <public-automotive@w3.org>
Thanks for the heartwarming comment :).

What I meant by "instantiation metadata" is the metadata in the YAML file
that is used to expand the tree. It is "consumed" by the tool to do the
expansion, but should not itself be propagated into the tool output file.
So what the tool currently does as was shown by Sebastian's test of it
should not be acceptable output.
The rule could be rewritten as Sebastian proposes, although I do not think
"flattened" is a clear term.

“Instantiation metadata SHALL be processed and expanded so the output
represents a flattened VSS tree”

BR
Ulf

On Wed, Jul 8, 2020 at 11:55 AM Schildt Sebastian (CR/ADT1) <
Sebastian.Schildt@de.bosch.com> wrote:

> Hello,
>
>
>
> As usual (well most of the time J ) what Ulf says makes sense.
>
>
>
> First two points I would agree, however for the last one
>
> “All metadata from a node in YAML MUST be preserved in the translations,
> except for instantiation metadata that MUST not be present. “
>
>
>
> I am not so sure. Because if exporting to “dumb” formats like .csv it
> might not even be possible to do that in a sane way. Personally I doubt the
> usefulness of CSV export anyway, but since some people use it/need it, such
> things should not be forbidden.
>
>
>
> I think we should formulate as guidelines
>
>   “All metadata from a node in YAML SHALL be preserved in the
> translations”
>
>
>
> For instantiation it is really the “instances are a VSS feature” vs.
> “instances are just syntactic sugar” we started yesterday . In the second
> case (I feel we are leaning that way currently)
>
> “Instantiation metadata SHALL be processed and expanded so the output
> represents a flattened VSS tree”
>
>
>
>
>
> Then I feel for “common” output formats we have today (like JSON, CSV), we
> should find some middle ground between saying “this IS VSS” and “this is
> just random code, please ignore”. We can say “When exporting to JSON/CSV,
> the canonical JSON/CSV output format should look like this”, because I
> think even following the 3 rules you laid out, there are probably many JSON
> formats that can adhere to them.
>
>
>
> Generators we are still “playing” with we can just mark as experimental
>
>
>
>
>
> Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards
>
> *Sebastian Schildt*
>
> Communication and Network Technology (DS1) (CR/ADT1)
> Robert Bosch GmbH | Renningen | 70465 Stuttgart | GERMANY | www.bosch.com
> Tel. +49 711 811-15765 | Mobil +49 173 7124227 |
> Sebastian.Schildt@de.bosch.com
>
> Sitz: Stuttgart, Registergericht: Amtsgericht Stuttgart, HRB 14000;
> Aufsichtsratsvorsitzender: Franz Fehrenbach; Geschäftsführung: Dr. Volkmar
> Denner,
> Prof. Dr. Stefan Asenkerschbaumer, Dr. Michael Bolle, Dr. Christian
> Fischer, Dr. Stefan Hartung,
> Dr. Markus Heyn, Harald Kröger, Christoph Kübel, Rolf Najork, Uwe Raschke,
> Peter Tyroller
> ​
>
> *Von:* Ulf Bjorkengren <ulfbjorkengren@geotab.com>
> *Gesendet:* Dienstag, 7. Juli 2020 21:20
> *An:* public-automotive <public-automotive@w3.org>
> *Betreff:* VSS instantiation discussion
>
>
>
> Regarding the VSS instantiation discussion I think we need to establish a
> few ground rules, in order to not get lost. Below is my attempt on a few
> rules for such a list.
>
>
>
> - YAML MUST unambiguously specify the path to a leaf node.
>
> - Translations from YAML to other formats MUST preserve the path
> definitions.
>
> - All metadata from a node in YAML MUST be preserved in the translations,
> except for instantiation metadata that MUST not be present.
>
>
>
> Regarding Gen2 and JSON I would say that Gen2 is agnostic to what format
> the VSS tree uses. Gen2 uses JSON as payload format, but that has nothing
> to do with what format the VSS tree is represented in. In the Gen2 impl
> project the VSS tree is represented in the native C format, as an example.
>
>
>
> BR
>
> Ulf
>
> --
>
> *Ulf Bjorkengren*
>
> *Geotab*
>
> Senior Connectivity Strategist | Ph. D.
>
> Mobile
>
> +45 53562142
>
> Visit
>
> www.geotab.com
> <https://eur03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.geotab.com%2F&data=02%7C01%7CSebastian.Schildt%40de.bosch.com%7C137d438259404c50051708d822aaa078%7C0ae51e1907c84e4bbb6d648ee58410f4%7C0%7C0%7C637297463511765880&sdata=kffgWrIQlBtFET762bnDj9kD4L2RpaHQwCczrtwAu4M%3D&reserved=0>
>
>
>


-- 
Ulf Bjorkengren
*Geotab*
Senior Connectivity Strategist | Ph. D.
Mobile +45 53562142
Visit www.geotab.com
Received on Wednesday, 8 July 2020 11:41:17 UTC

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