Re: ARIA TPAC Meeting to discuss Javascript Accessibility API

cool

Rich Schwerdtfeger




> On Aug 30, 2016, at 1:47 PM, James Craig <jcraig@apple.com> wrote:
> 
> She requested more time this morning:
> 
> "I am working on solidifying Microsoft's position on this work. I hope to have an answer next week." 
> 
> Source: https://github.com/w3c/webcomponents/issues/553#issuecomment-243533465 <https://github.com/w3c/webcomponents/issues/553#issuecomment-243533465>
> 
> 
>> On Aug 30, 2016, at 11:34 AM, Rich Schwerdtfeger <richschwer@gmail.com <mailto:richschwer@gmail.com>> wrote:
>> 
>> Cynthia, please clarify for us. 
>> 
>> My impression was that your tone of voice was very dismissive of the effort on the call. 
>> 
>> Rich
>> 
>> Rich Schwerdtfeger
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On Aug 30, 2016, at 1:27 PM, James Craig <jcraig@apple.com <mailto:jcraig@apple.com>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Moving Cynthia and Bogdan to the To: field.
>>> 
>>>> On Aug 30, 2016, at 7:04 AM, Rich Schwerdtfeger <richschwer@gmail.com <mailto:richschwer@gmail.com>> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> Hi James, 
>>>> 
>>>> I moved the discussion to Thursday at TPAC and yes, the AOM was one of the bulleted list of items to discuss. Dominic, you of course have my approval to come as an observer. We would love to have you as well as Alice Boxhall. I am copying Arnaud Le Hors.
>>>> 
>>>> A WICG was established with the agreement to work on an accessibility api, which Cynthia Shelly was to lead. When this was started, Microsoft had introduced a JavaScript Accessibility API called WAPA. AOM is another API. The discussion has been dormant for months with no mention of an AOM. This meeting is to discuss both and a way forward and hopefully to get everyone on the same page. 
>>>> 
>>>> A deliverable of the ARIA working group was a Web Applications Interaction Model as well as work on ARIA 2.0 is to work on an WAI-ARIA interaction module (I don’t really care what it is called or which group owns the deliverable). Part of that work, for some time now was to work on a Java Script Accessibility API to be aligned with the work on ARIA 2.0 to be able to do things we could not do with ARIA such as 2 way communication, device independent interaction, and extensibility. For a long time we have discussed a need for such an accessibility api to better address canvas accessibility, online office suite development, and so on. I only found out about this API work when Domenec (Google) posted on that issue ask how platform accessibility apis addressed extensibility which is one of the things needed for ARIA 2.0. That brought into the discussion of UIA which is designed for extensibility in that they can combine control patterns to produce custom controls and the ATs can discover how to work with them based on their control patterns. 
>>>> 
>>>> The confusion came from the fact that we were told that that this WICG was going to work on WAPA and instead we found interested parties working on a different spec. after no activity on WICG related to accessibility APIs. It became even more confusing when Cynthia stated they were no longer interested in the AOM work and she was listed as an editor. If Microsoft does not endorse the work that is a huge problem for industry adoption. 
>>> 
>>> According to the ARIA minutes <https://www.w3.org/2016/08/25-aria-minutes.html>, Cynthia said "Microsoft is no longer involved" and it's true there hasn't been much activity since the face-to-face meeting in May. 
>>> 
>>> I wasn't on the ARIA call last week, but if she really meant, Microsoft is "no longer interested" or "does not endorse", it's news to me.
>>> 
>>>> I did not ask Cynthia why Microsoft took the position.
>>> 
>>> According to Cynthia on Friday of last week, Microsoft had not yet taken any official position. To my knowledge, none of the participating companies have stated a formal intent to implement.
>>> 
>>>> I will leave that to Cynthia to respond to. Leonie and Charles also asked the TAG to get involved in the whole discussion so we are meeting with them Friday.
>>>> 
>>>> The net is we will be wrapping up ARIA 1.1 and we need to focus on what the web accessibility community wants to do to address the next generation of accessible applications.
>>>> 
>>>> I do plan to read the AOM spec. prior to TPAC. 
>>>> 
>>>> Regards,
>>>> 
>>>> Rich
>>>> 
>>>> Rich Schwerdtfeger
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> On Aug 29, 2016, at 11:15 PM, James Craig <jcraig@apple.com <mailto:jcraig@apple.com>> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> Hi Rich (copying the other AOM contributors and Dave Singer),
>>>>> 
>>>>> If by "Java Script Accessibility API", you mean the work-in-progress Accessibility Object Model spec <http://a11y-api.github.io/a11y-api/spec/>, can we move the discussion to ARIA's TPAC agenda for Thursday? 
>>>>> 
>>>>> I'll be attending the Web Platform meetings on Monday the 19th (for Web Components) and Friday the 23rd (for HTML, Platform Tests, etc). CSS on Tuesday the 20th. I proposed a Technical Plenary breakout on Wednesday the 21st to discuss AOM.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Dominic works for a member org, so he can register as an observer to any group with the Chair's permission. No need to join the Working Group unless he wants to for other reasons. I believe Alice Boxhall from Google is planning to attend TPAC as well.
>>>>> 
>>>>> I addressed some of the AOM concerns you raised in this GitHub comment:
>>>>> https://github.com/w3c/webcomponents/issues/553#issuecomment-243314488 <https://github.com/w3c/webcomponents/issues/553#issuecomment-243314488>
>>>>> 
>>>>> From that and other threads it seems like there is a lot of confusion regarding AOM. Some of it would be addressed by reading the spec, contribution documents, and my comments on the GitHub thread above. I'm also happy to give a summary in one of the ARIA calls before TPAC if you like. This week is probably too soon, as we're waiting to hear back from Cynthia and Bogdan on Microsoft's continued involvement. Once Dominic has sent the spec contribution to the WICG list, all feedback is welcome.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>> James Craig
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>>> On Aug 29, 2016, at 11:45 AM, Rich Schwerdtfeger <richschwer@gmail.com <mailto:richschwer@gmail.com>> wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Hi Dominic,
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> I wanted to make you aware of a discussion we will be having at TPAC regarding extensibility, web components, ARIA and a Java Script Accessibility API. We will be discussing your API work on Friday: https://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/wiki/Meetings/TPAC_2016 <https://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/wiki/Meetings/TPAC_2016>. We would love to have you there at TPAC. I think you would need to join either the Web Platforms working group or the ARIA working group to attend. 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Chris, you are most welcome to come and you have done such great work on webkit accessibility. I am working for the ARIA Working Group to meet with Web components earlier in the week.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Best,
>>>>>> Rich
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Rich Schwerdtfeger
>> 
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