W3C home > Mailing lists > Public > www-svg@w3.org > November 2002

Re: Identical rendering? [was Re: SVG 1.2 General feedback]

From: Thomas E Deweese <thomas.deweese@kodak.com>
Date: Wed, 20 Nov 2002 09:11:40 -0500
Message-ID: <15835.38940.261151.129072@frog.rl.kodak.com>
To: Tobias Reif <tobiasreif@pinkjuice.com>
Cc: www-svg@w3.org, Vadim Plessky <plessky@cnt.ru>

>>>>> "TR" == Tobias Reif <tobiasreif@pinkjuice.com> writes:

TR> Vadim Plessky wrote:

>> On Tuesday 19 November 2002 3:13 pm, Tobias Reif wrote: | Vadim
>> Plessky wrote: | > First I need to see SVG fonts,
>> |
>> | You can get lots of free TTF fonts, then convert them to SVG Font
>> via | Batik. It's a lot of fun.
>> 
>> In a short: I stopped using TTF fonts about year ago, and actively
>> promote usage of PostScript Type1 (or Type2/CFF) fonts.

   Any particular reason why?

>> But thanks for this reference, may be one day I would install Batik
>> and try this.  Does it convert TrueType hints (opcodes) to SVG,
>> too?

   SVG fonts have no notion of font hinting. None - zip - zilch -
zero.  Yes, it is clear that this makes them almost useless for small
font sizes.  On the up side most SVG viewers do use anti-aliasing for
rendering text, while this certainly does not solve the problem it
helps.

   I don't think the SVG WG is likely to add font hinting to SVG fonts
- my impression is that one must step very carefully here to avoid a
minefield of patents.

>> I still should to learn *why* you may want to have filters or
>> animations inside *font*.

TR> Fancy splash screens, film credits over SMIL flicks etc etc. The
TR> idea is not to use animated etc glyphs for regular text, but to
TR> make fancy logos, designs, styles (thing graffiti) etc accessible,
TR> and platform independent.

    There are lots of 'art' fonts that would look _much_ better if
they could use color.  You could then have real 'illuminated' fonts,
etc.

>> "Right tool for the right task", IMO.

TR> Exactly. No one said you should use these possibilities at all, or
TR> that you should use them where they are not appropriate.

    Correct.

>> | > For example, it seems that Adobe SVG plugin (Windows) renders
>> fonts on | > its own, ignoring Windows font rasterizer.  | > While
>> such approach may be ok for Adobe's graphics apps (PhotoShop, | >
>> Illustrator), text at small sizes (8pt-12pt) in unreadable in such
>> case
>> |
>> | Use the renderung related properties to make small text readable.
>> 
>> Do you mean, "hints"?


TR> Why don't you simply play with the text rendering properties in
TR> SVG to solve your problem?

    I think 'hint' is getting over used here, There is a family of
'rendering hints' (section 11.7) that you can set on elements in SVG -
like text-rendering="optimizeLegibility" - that renderers can use to
know what the author intends for the text - for a large Corporate logo
you probably want anti-aliasing etc, for the 'fine-print' you probably
want font-hinting with no anti-aliasing.  These properties allow
content authors to inform the renderer what is appropriate.

    Just so it is clear SVG isn't aiming to replace HTML - where text
is king, it is trying to provide a format where vector graphics and
text and raster images play a more balanced role.
Received on Wednesday, 20 November 2002 09:12:03 GMT

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