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Re: Float overflowing behavior

From: C.Bottelier <c.bottelier@ITsec.nl>
Date: Wed, 14 Aug 2002 17:32:08 +0200
Message-ID: <3D5A77F8.C4578CA9@ITsec.nl>
To: www-style@w3.org

Following this thread I see a lot of posts containg examples
for which the changed behaviour of a float is handy / needed.
But it lacks cases that proves why the current behaviour is
useful.

I agree that changing the behaviour of a float is bad. The
(correct) implementation of CSS is sparse, if the behaviour
of existing attributes keep changing there will never be
a good implementation. There's even the risk that authors
will turn away from CSS!

The release of the CSS2.1 WD may already give user agent
manufacturers the idea that if they find implementing
the CSS specification too hard (or too much work) they
just don't implement it because then after some time their
problem will go away by it self. Why implement CSS3? If we
wait awhile those new things will be dropped, problem solved!


In my oppinion specification, recommendation and standards
can only evolve in the following ways:
 1. By addition and extention if:
     a) There is a better way that can coexsist with
        the old way
 2. By replacement (deprication of the old) if:
     a) There is a better way and the old way
        cannot coexsist with the new way.
     b) It is wrong but is used often or inoften
 3. By removal if:
     a) It is utterly wrong and causes harm
     b) Is a wrong and has never been used


Christian


Bill Daly wrote:
> 
> --- Jan Roland Eriksson <jrexon@newsguy.com> wrote:
> > And yet the real solution is so fantastically
> > simple?
> >
> >   <http://css.nu/exp/layer-ex3b.html>
> >   <http://css.nu/exp/layer-ex3b.html>
> >   <http://css.nu/exp/layer-ex3d.html>
> 
> I don't see that as a solution, so much as a hack.
> The empty div which you add in those examples has no
> relevance to the structure of the document, and does
> not belong.  It is being used purely for
> presentational purposes.  While I have seen this in
> use, and have used it myself in some cases, I don't
> see it as the proper way for this effect to be
> accomplished.
> 
> Now, while I don't agree with the previous mailing
> about changing the default behavior of floats, I am in
> agreement with the original message which started this
> thread.  What is needed is some CSS property which can
> be applied to a floated element which will allow its
> container element to take the size of the floated
> element into account and adjust its size accordingly.
> 
> Take, for example, the following code snippet
> representing an online product catalog:
> 
> <div class="product">
>     <DEFANGED_IMG class="productimage" src="product1.jpg">
>     <p>This is Product Description 1</p>
> </div>
> 
> <div class="product">
>     <DEFANGED_IMG class="productimage" src="product2.jpg">
>     <p>This is Product Description 2</p>
> </div>
> 
> .productimage {
>     float: left;
> }
> 
> Now, in the case of a product catalog, the behavior
> one would be looking for would be for each product's
> picture to be next to its product description.  Given
> the current implementation, a "productimage" whose
> height is larger than that of its product description
> text would overflow into the div of the next product,
> causing confusion to someone who may be viewing the
> page as to which pictures belong with which
> descriptions.
> 
> Yes, you can achieve the desired effect with the
> method of the empty div which you proposed earlier,
> but is that extraneous markup truly the proper way to
> go when it could be solved with a CSS property?
> 
> Imagine, if you will, someone new to web design.  What
> would be more intuitive for them to do?  Add an empty
> div, or use a defined CSS property like the proposed
> float-overflow which says exactly whose name implies
> the exact desired effect?
> 
> In my opinion, the float-overflow property proposed in
> the message beginning this thread would be the best
> solution, so long as the current default behavior of
> floats is maintained when it is not specified.
> 
> Bill Daly
> 
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Received on Wednesday, 14 August 2002 11:32:22 GMT

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