Re: summary="" in HTML5 ISSUE-32

I don't think it is possible to associate a <p> programatically</p to  
a table.  It might be possible to designate someting inside the table  
to surve the same purpurpose as @summary though.

I also want to point out that I consider it a grose miss use of  
@summary="" required to pass a test as well, miss use.

I appreciate the efforts on this but also hear and echo the conerns of  
others that we *really* need to have a good replacement or modify  
@summary to do what we need for it to do.

On Feb 25, 2009, at 2:37 PM, Jonas Sicking wrote:

On Wed, Feb 25, 2009 at 10:50 AM, David Poehlman  
<poehlman1@comcast.net> wrote:
> <p> this is a layout table.
> <p> there is no summary for this table...
> Now, where was that little d?

I'm sorry, I don't understand the question? Could you elaborate?

> Not picking on you but we need programatic association and clear  
> markup
> which @summary provides today.

This would indeed not be the case with the proposal to have a separate
paragraph (marked up with a <p>) before or after the table.

Could you elaborate on why this is needed?

If we added an attribute like summaryfor="idOfTable" to the <p>, would
that address all the problems you have with this proposed solution? Or
adding a summaryIn="idOfPara" on the <table>. I'm not suggesting this
as a solution, merely trying to understand your complaints with the
<p> solution.

Also, this problem (if it indeed is a problem) does not seem to exist
with any of the other solutions proposed. Maciej listed many more than
I did.

/ Jonas

> On Feb 25, 2009, at 1:42 PM, Jonas Sicking wrote:
>
> On Wed, Feb 25, 2009 at 9:23 AM, David Poehlman  
> <poehlman1@comcast.net>
> wrote:
>>
>> What actually mystifies me and I've been following every nuounce of  
>> the
>> conversation over a long span on several lists is that there has  
>> not been
>> shown to be anything satisfactorily demonstrated to replace what  
>> can be
>> and
>> has been used as such an accessibility enhancing attribute as  
>> @summary.
>
> Two suggestions I've seen so far are:
>
> * Use a <p> above the table describing the contents of the table.
> * Change the definition of <caption> to not just be the title of the
> table to also be allowed to contain a summary.
>
> Both these have the advantage if adding accessibility to all users
> rather than just ones that use AT clients.
>
> Another suggestion I've thought about is using the table@title
> attribute. Title attributes are already often used to add descriptive
> information out-of-flow. And title attributes are generally available
> in visual UAs in the form of tooltips.
>
> / Jonas
>
>
>
> --
> Jonnie Appleseed
> with his
> Hands-On Technolog(eye)s
> reducing technology's disabilities
> one byte at a time
>
>



-- 
Jonnie Appleseed
with his
Hands-On Technolog(eye)s
reducing technology's disabilities
one byte at a time