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RE: Is time running out for the without STYLE SHEET guidelines?

From: John Foliot - bytown internet <foliot@bytowninternet.com>
Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 18:57:17 -0500
To: "Jesper Tverskov" <jesper.tverskov@mail.tele.dk>, <w3c-wai-ig@w3.org>
Message-ID: <GKEFJJEKDDIMBHJOGLENOEPCDBAA.foliot@bytowninternet.com>

Jesper,

I will echo the two comments received so far (both from active and valuable members of this list).  I also have a concern regarding one of the statements you made, especially in terms of backward compatibility.

You state that you will generate a dynamic gallery of photos using DHTML, which presumably will include the use of client side scripting (especially in light of your "too slow" server-side comment).  If this is the case, what happens when support for said script is not there?  Boom - no content?

If you choose to make the principle method of delivering you photos via client side script, great, but remember to provide an alternative to users who do not (cannot?) use script enabled browsers.

(Priority 1 - 6.3 Ensure that pages are usable when scripts, applets, or other programmatic objects are turned off or not supported. If this is not possible, provide equivalent information on an alternative accessible page.) 

I would suspect that the same basic issue holds true for your DHTML menus as well...

Finally, what happens if the end user chooses to employ their own style sheet instead of your "supplied" style sheet, say for example one which ensures high-contrast colors and/or larger than normal font sizes?  While in the "here-and-now" of web development this is more theoretical than practical, we most certainly are headed in that direction.  Will your site fall down completely in that scenario?  

No, I suspect that the requirement will remain for quite some time...

JF


> 
> 
> 
> It has been discussed before:
> 
> WAICAG, Checkpoint 6.1:
> Organize documents so they may be read without style sheets. [Priority 1]
> 
> Section 508 Guidelines, 1194.22(d):
> "Documents shall be organized so they are readable without 
> requiring an associated stylesheet"
> 
> I use valid XHTML 1.1: all presentation is in the style sheet. If 
> I also drop my last table for layout and use CSS and absolute 
> positioning even on the homepage, and if I use DHTML in order to 
> make a wonderful dynamic menu system with hundreds of links, if I 
> use a style sheet for printing to hide navigation, if I use DHTML 
> in order to make a dynamic gallery of photos (forget server-side, 
> it is too slow)... I have my doubts if much of it will work with 
> out the style sheet. It will probably still be readable, more or 
> less, but not in any useful sense of the word.
> 
> In the above cases it does not make sense at all for a user style 
> sheet or the browser default to take over.
> 
> Is time running out for the "without style sheets" guidelines?
> 
> Cheers,
> Jesper Tverskov
> 
> 
> 
> 
Received on Wednesday, 29 January 2003 18:57:27 GMT

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