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Re: [Proposal] schema:OnlineCourse

From: Wes Turner <wes.turner@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2014 07:12:21 -0600
Message-ID: <CACfEFw9epWqzq3csUUwoATtzNK911MJzWBohcRqfm3hhWpAH5w@mail.gmail.com>
To: "Barker, Phil A" <Phil.Barker@hw.ac.uk>
Cc: Vicki Tardif Holland <vtardif@google.com>, GUANGYUAN PIAO <parklize@gmail.com>, Thad Guidry <thadguidry@gmail.com>, Aaron Bradley <aaranged@gmail.com>, Public Vocabs <public-vocabs@w3.org>
re: CourseSession / Class / CourseSection / Workshop

https://itacademy.unomaha.edu/ is an "IT Professional Academy" which offers
"Workshops" that could have educationalAlignments .

ASCII sort may be a good deciding factor here.

On Tue, Dec 16, 2014 at 6:56 AM, Wes Turner <wes.turner@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > 1. Courses can comprise Courses. This is especially important at
> Universities that recruit into and award certificates for programmes
> (Courses) that are built from modules (Courses).
>
> Is this satisfied by http://schema.org/isPartOf , or is there a need for
> a more specific property?
>
> > 2. I don't think there is much to be gained from having a separate
> class on OnlineCourse rather than a property of a Course to flag whether it
> is online or not. I  think the properties you have for OnlineCourse also
> apply to regular courses. Most regular courses have an online component.
>
> So long as there is something to indicate that a Course is a "MOOC".
>
> > 3. I think it would be better to model an instance of a Course as a
> collection of EducationalEvents and CreativeWorks.
>
> This could indeed be useful for e.g. modeling a Syllabus.
>
> Use Case: I've been thinking about how to express a curriculum set with/as
> RDFa. I have a number of PDFs; and I have a number of wikipedia
> topic/concept links which are advantageous in that they are translated
> conceptual identifiers, in dbpedia. These could be 'educationalAlignment'
> 'AlignmentObject.targetURL' s, if they were an 'established educational
> framework.' [1][2] ... How do I legitimize this with parenthetical
> notations and necessary RDFa?
>
> In consultation with the authors of SKOS about adding prefPluralLabel (not
> likely, in the near future), I learned about
> http://rdf-vocabulary.ddialliance.org/xkos.html , which demonstrates
> usage of rdf:List ; which would be useful for expressing an ordered set of
> syllabi things that have URIs and metadata.
>
> > 4. [normative epistemiology:
> http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/learning-formal/ ]
>
> "Education must provide the opportunities for self-fulfillment; it can at
> best provide a rich and challenging environment for the individual to
> explore, in [his] own way." -- Chomsky
>
>
> > [...] do you have some usecases in mind and target example websites?
> It's difficult to assess whether these properties are sufficient and
> realistic without those.
>
> If you have the time to dig through, this thread [3] lists a number of
> hypothetical and actual use cases:
>
>
>    - http://www.edumine.com/
>    - http://www.ieee.org/portal/innovate/products/educational/
>    - https://www.futurelearn.com/
>    - https://www.udacity.com/
>    - https://www.edx.org/
>    - https://www.coursera.org/
>    - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_learning_management_systems
>    - [University] Course Catalogs contain prerequisites and matriculation
>    requirements
>    - US Primary education standards: http://www.corestandards.org/
>    "Common Core"
>       - This could potentially be extremely useful for discovering useful
>       curriculum resources
>    - https://developers.google.com/edu/curriculumsearch/
>    (educationalAlignment -> "Course")
>
>
>    - Src: https://github.com/edx/
>    - Src:
>    https://github.com/classcentral/class-central/tree/master/src/ClassCentral/SiteBundle/Entity
>
>
> [1] https://westurner.github.io/redditlog/#comment/ci3c1o3
> [2] https://wrdrd.github.io/docs/consulting/knowledge-engineering.html
> [3] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-vocabs/2014Feb/0131.html
>
>
> On Tue, Dec 16, 2014 at 5:19 AM, Barker, Phil A <Phil.Barker@hw.ac.uk>
> wrote:
>>
>>
>> Vicki, thanks for the heads up, I would have missed this otherwise.
>>
>> I have added some comments to the Google Doc, the most significant are:
>>
>> 1. Courses can comprise Courses. This is especially important at
>> Universities that recruit into and award certificates for programmes
>> (Courses) that are built from modules (Courses).
>>
>> 2. I don't think there is much to be gained from having a separate class
>> on OnlineCourse rather than a property of a Course to flag whether it is
>> online or not. I  think the properties you have for OnlineCourse also apply
>> to regular courses. Most regular courses have an online component.
>>
>> 3. I think it would be better to model an instance of a Course as a
>> collection of EducationalEvents and CreativeWorks.
>>
>> 4. Language is difficult. The different usage between UK and US English
>> is one thing, but more importantly commonly used terms often relate to
>> specific education systems or pedagogies. So phrases like "instructors
>> deliver lessons to students" implies a particular pedagogy. Also this means
>> that common terms become ambiguous and open to misinterpretation in
>> international use, e.g. class, course, programme, module. This is important
>> in schema.org where definitions tend to be minimalist.
>>
>> Hope this helps.
>>
>> As a general question, do you have some usecases in mind and target
>> example websites? It's difficult to assess whether these properties are
>> sufficient and realistic without those.
>>
>> Phil
>>
>>
>>  ------------------------------
>> *From:* Vicki Tardif Holland [vtardif@google.com]
>> *Sent:* 15 December 2014 18:40
>> *To:* Wes Turner
>> *Cc:* GUANGYUAN PIAO; Thad Guidry; Aaron Bradley; Public Vocabs
>> *Subject:* Re: [Proposal] schema:OnlineCourse
>>
>>   (I commented on GitHub, but I am not sure if everyone is over there,
>> so I am duplicating the message here.)
>>
>>  I have read through all of the comments and background links and
>> attempted to pull the various ideas into a cohesive whole. My thoughts are
>> still rather preliminary, but can be found at
>> https://docs.google.com/document/d/12YWjLzZC8FiTiOwSAETRIEozeqZdn6O8a4fgqK4t5Ss/edit?usp=sharing
>>
>>  It would be nice to be able to support in-person classes (academic or
>> not) and MOOCs.
>>
>>  Please comment here or on GitHub.
>>
>>  - Vicki
>>
>>
>>   Vicki Tardif Holland | Ontologist | vtardif@google.com
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Dec 11, 2014 at 4:35 PM, Wes Turner <wes.turner@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>>
>>> I've created a GitHub issue ticket for this Proposal:
>>>
>>>  https://github.com/rvguha/schemaorg/issues/195
>>>
>>>  cc'ing a comment here, because DRY:
>>>
>>>   What is missing or could be added?
>>>> From
>>>> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-vocabs/2014Feb/0127.html :
>>>>
>>>>> Properties:
>>>>>
>>>>>    - derivedFrom/previousIncantation property could also be helpful.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>    - prerequisitve/buildsUpon/suggestedPrerequisite properties would
>>>>>    be great.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>
>>>> Types for these properties would need to be <Course>.
>>>
>>>  ... This would then form a graph of Courses and/or OnlineCourses.
>>>
>>>
>>>  It may be most helpful to transition discussion to a task-focused
>>> GitHub issue.
>>>
>>> On Thu, Nov 6, 2014 at 10:16 PM, Wes Turner <wes.turner@gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> In creating said ticket [openbadges/openbadges-specifiation/9], I'm
>>>> having trouble linking to the entirety of a mailing list thread (who know).
>>>>
>>>>  Is there / should there be an issue for OnlineCourse here:
>>>> https://github.com/rvguha/schemaorg/issues ?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, Nov 6, 2014 at 10:10 PM, Wes Turner <wes.turner@gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I've opened a ticket with the OpenBadges specification project:
>>>>> https://github.com/openbadges/openbadges-specification/issues/9
>>>>>
>>>>>  > How could/should we reference badges offered by a
>>>>> schema.org/OnlineCourse ?
>>>>>
>>>>> > We could point to just URIs, but then we'd need to lookup badge
>>>>> titles.
>>>>>
>>>>> > Would it be feasible to create schema.org/Badge ?
>>>>>
>>>>> On Thu, Nov 6, 2014 at 9:52 PM, Wes Turner <wes.turner@gmail.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Thu, Nov 6, 2014 at 3:11 PM, GUANGYUAN PIAO <parklize@gmail.com>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>  1. Is it worth adding a "prerequisiteCourse" property to list the
>>>>>>> prerequisites for the given course?
>>>>>>>      - IMO, "prerequisiteCourse" or "requirements" for the Course
>>>>>>> could provide rich snippets for users to know if it
>>>>>>> is appropriate for him/her.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>  Where can I add topical links to wikipedia (dbpedia [1])? e.g. This
>>>>>> course is about https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linked_data and
>>>>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semantic_Web
>>>>>>
>>>>>> [1] http://lod-cloud.net/
>>>>>>
>>>>>>   2. Can we change "isCertificateAvailable" from a boolean to
>>>>>>> something with a little more data? Maybe the type of certificate granted or
>>>>>>> the institution granting the certificate?
>>>>>>>      - +1, and then it will need Certificate type and additional
>>>>>>> properties to think about.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  http://openbadges.org/ are gaining momentum. [2]
>>>>>>
>>>>>>  Would "credential" be a more generic predicate?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>  [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mozilla_Open_Badges
>>>>>> [3] https://wiki.mozilla.org/Badges
>>>>>> [4] https://github.com/mozilla/openbadges#mozilla-open-badges
>>>>>> [5]
>>>>>> https://github.com/openbadges/openbadges-specification/blob/master/Assertion/latest.md
>>>>>> (JSON Web Signatures)
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>  --
>>>>>> Wes Turner
>>>>>> https://westurner.github.io/
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>  --
>>>>> Wes Turner
>>>>> https://westurner.github.io/
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>  --
>>>> Wes Turner
>>>> https://westurner.github.io/
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
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>
Received on Tuesday, 16 December 2014 13:12:50 UTC

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