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meeting record: 2009-01-27 SemWeb Deployment WG

From: Ralph R. Swick <swick@w3.org>
Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2009 12:08:33 -0500
Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.2.20090127120649.0274a008@127.0.0.1>
To: public-swd-wg@w3.org

The minutes of today's Semantic Web Deployment Working Group telecon
are now available:

   http://www.w3.org/2009/01/27-swd-minutes.html

A text snapshot follows.

----

                                SWD WG

27 Jan 2009

   [2]Agenda

      [2] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2009Jan/0081.html

   See also: [3]IRC log, previous [4]2009-01-20

      [3] http://www.w3.org/2009/01/27-swd-irc
      [4] http://www.w3.org/2009/01/20-swd-minutes.html

Attendees

   Present
          Tom Baker, Ralph Swick, Guus Schreiber, Alistair Miles,
          Antoine Isaac, Ben Adida, Ed Summers

   Regrets
          Margherita Sini, Sean Bechhofer

   Chair
          Guus

   Scribe
          Ralph

Contents

     * Topics
         1. Admin
         2. SKOS CR
         3. SKOS Primer
         4. SKOS Implementation Report
         5. RDFa
         6. Recipes
         7. Metadata Note
         8. Other Business
         9. "Standard" vs. mapping relationships in Primer
     * Summary of Action Items
     _____________________________________________________

Admin

   RESOLVED to accept [16]minutes of 20-Jan meeting

     [16] http://www.w3.org/2009/01/20-swd-minutes.html

   RESOLVED next telecon 10 Feb

   Guus: typo in the month in my agenda mail

SKOS CR

   Ralph:when we enter last call
   ...we are required to notify all other WGs, remind them of end date
   ... so if any WGs have comments, they get notice
   ... We (I or chairs) should have sent message to chairs list
   ... I remembered to send message to WG about last call, should've
   also sent to chairs

   Guus: one editorial comment from I18N

   Alistair: yep, it's editorial

   Guus: propose to accept the change

   -> "[17]Re: Request for feedback on SKOS Last Call Working Draft"
   [Felix Sasaki 2009-01-24]

     [17] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2009Jan/0069.html

   "editorial comment re: Japanese scripts"; now [18]issue-188

     [18] http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/track/issues/188

   PROPOSED: resolve issue-188 by accepting the commentor's edit

   RESOLVED issue-188 closed by accepting the commentor's edit

   ACTION: Alistair respond to Felix re: issue-188 [recorded in
   [19]http://www.w3.org/2009/01/27-swd-minutes.html#action01]

SKOS Primer

   Guus: does the Primer contain the same text about Japanese scripts?

   Antoine: don't think so

SKOS Implementation Report

   ACTION: [DONE] Guus to report on usage of SKOS in vocabularies at VU
   for SKOS implementation report [recorded in
   [20]http://www.w3.org/2009/01/06-swd-minutes.html#action09]

     [20] http://www.w3.org/2009/01/06-swd-minutes.html#action09

   -> "[21]SKOS usage at eCulture/Europeana" [27]

     [21] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2009Jan/0080.html
     [27] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2009Jan/thread.html#msg64

   Guus: the table Antoine cites might be a format we copy for our
   implementation report

   Antoine: we might improve this by allowing sort by column and by
   clustering the columns by general function
   ... any feedback is welcom

   -> [22]table of SKOS usage

     [22] http://www.few.vu.nl/~ronny/eculture/skos-usage-eculture.html

   -> [23]Thought Lab portal

     [23] http://www.europeana.eu/portal/thought-lab.html

   Guus: This is the new European Union-funded portal
   ... was presented in October to EU Ministries and got a lot of Press
   attention
   ... 10m hits/hour on the first day
   ... re-opened end of December with increased server capacity
   ... [24]Thought Lab is the experimental SemWeb implementation; gets
   several thousand hits/day
   ... Thought Lab is a public demonstrator with data from 3
   institutions; Rijksmuseum Amsterdam, Musee du Louvre, Netherlands
   Institute for Art History

     [24] http://www.europeana.eu/portal/thought-lab.html

   ACTION: [PENDING] Sean to report on SKOSED for SKOS implementation
   report [recorded in
   [25]http://www.w3.org/2009/01/06-swd-minutes.html#action10]

     [25] http://www.w3.org/2009/01/06-swd-minutes.html#action10

   -> "[26]application in indexing and search" Johan De Smedt
   2009-01-23]

     [26] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2009Jan/0064.html

   Guus: Johan's message is applicable to our implementation report;
   [27]the thread includes notes on two checkers

     [27] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2009Jan/thread.html#msg64

   Alistair: I can take a look and maybe provide feedback

   Guus: need someone to volunteer as editor for implementation report

   Ralph: I was hoping Sean would take this :)

   Guus: I'll ask Sean

   Alistair: I'm totally maxed out, sorry

   Guus: I may ask someone not currently in the group

   ACTION: Guus discuss with Sean editors for the SKOS implementation
   report [recorded in
   [28]http://www.w3.org/2009/01/27-swd-minutes.html#action04]

RDFa

   Ben: we're actively working on updating the use cases in the wiki
   ... and Michael will update the Note based on the wiki content
   ... a lot of the wiki update is motivated by discussions with the
   HTML Working Group
   ... the Task Force has onging work on providing guidance on how to
   make RDFa friendly to HTML

   ACTION: [PENDING] Ben review RDFa Use Cases and propose transition
   to Group Note [recorded in
   [29]http://www.w3.org/2008/09/30-swd-minutes.html#action02]

     [29] http://www.w3.org/2008/09/30-swd-minutes.html#action02

Recipes

   ACTION: [PENDING] Ralph to review the revised Recipes draft
   [recorded in
   [30]http://www.w3.org/2008/12/02-swd-minutes.html#action15]

     [30] http://www.w3.org/2008/12/02-swd-minutes.html#action15

   ACTION: [PENDING] Ralph/Diego to work on Wordnet implementation [of
   Recipes implementations] [recorded in
   [31]http://www.w3.org/2008/01/22-swd-minutes.html#action20]

     [31] http://www.w3.org/2008/01/22-swd-minutes.html#action20

Metadata Note

   ACTION: [PENDING] Ralph post his comments on the editor's draft of
   the metadata note [recorded in
   [32]http://www.w3.org/2008/11/25-swd-minutes.html#action03]

     [32] http://www.w3.org/2008/11/25-swd-minutes.html#action03

Other Business

   ACTION: [PENDING] Guus to look at OWL documents for review [recorded
   in [33]http://www.w3.org/2008/10/21-swd-minutes.html#action10]

     [33] http://www.w3.org/2008/10/21-swd-minutes.html#action10

   Guus: I've started this, hope to post a draft response by the end of
   the week
   ... a short summary of my comments: (a) the number of additional
   features provided is useful for characterizing SKOS properties
   ... (b) none of the documents are really accessible to a typical
   SKOS reader
   ... (c) the documents appear to be very biased toward the -DL
   version of the language

   Ralph: I would concur with all three

   Alistair: me too

   <TomB> +1 on Guus's comments

"Standard" vs. mapping relationships in Primer

   -> [34]"Mapping" vs "standard" relationships [Tom 2009-01-13] start
   of thread

     [34] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2009Jan/0048.html

   <TomB> [35]Antoine's message on 27 January

     [35] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2009Jan/0077.html

   Antoine: it's still difficult to evaluate; the discussion is around
   one sentence
   ... whether to keep or remove or change this sentence
   ... the discussion is still ongoing
   ... but the conclusion will be easy to write once we agree

   Tom: the Primer currently in queue to be published seems to
   recommend the use of mapping relationships when enriching a
   vocabulary
   ... the minimal approach taken in SKOS Reference makes a simpler
   distinction; it says only that you should use standard relationships
   when talking about relationships within a concept scheme and mapping
   relationships between schemes
   ... the current editor's draft of the Primer suggests using mapping
   relationships when someone other than the owner is making
   relationships within a concept scheme
   ... this appears to me to be a bit of an inconsistency
   ... for the next version of the Primer it would be good to decide
   this
   ... "enrichment within a concept scheme" is one suggestion
   ... I would accept a minimum solution
   ... if Antoine's point could be articulated in a way to satisfy
   everyone, I see some value in it

   Ed: what's the one sentence?

   <TomB> [36]SWD/SKOS/primer/primer-20090113

     [36] http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/SKOS/primer/primer-20090113.html

   Antoine: the discussion started with a sentence about enrichment

   Tom: see end of [37]section 3.1
   ... "However, the use of mapping properties might also be
   appropriate in cases where someone other than its owner needs to
   enrich the semantic relationships within a particular concept
   scheme."
   ... the question is whether this goes beyond what SKOS Reference
   says

     [37] http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/SKOS/primer/primer-20090113.html#secmapping

   Guus: what would be the problem in deleting the sentence?

   <aliman> Key section from SKOS Reference, [38]section 10.6.1.
   Mapping Properties, Semantic Relation Properties and Concept
   Schemes, """By convention, the SKOS mapping properties are only used
   to link concepts in different concept schemes."""

     [38] http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/SKOS/reference/20081001/#mapping

   Guus: we could see what practices are adopted
   ... this doesn't sound like a necessary statement for a Primer
   ... but could agree that this sort of hint is not appropriate for a
   Primer
   ... it's not a strong hint anyway; I'd feel more comfortable
   removing it.
   ... if we had more time, I'd hope the document would be shorter :)
   ... would dropping this sentence remove the problem?

   Alistair: think so

   Tom: looking at the preceeding sentence ...
   ... the paragraph before isn't necessarily the best wording but I
   don't have anything better to suggest right now

   Guus: I suggest we drop the 'However ...' sentence from the Primer

   Antoine: OK with me

   Alistair: OK to drop

   Tom: OK to drop

   ACTION: SKOS Editors drop "However, the use of mapping properties
   might..." sentence from the primer section 3.1 [recorded in
   [39]http://www.w3.org/2009/01/27-swd-minutes.html#action10]

   [adjourned]

   <ed> TomB, thanks for the detailed look at Primer

Summary of Action Items

   [NEW] ACTION: Alistair respond to Felix re: issue-188 [recorded in
   [40]http://www.w3.org/2009/01/27-swd-minutes.html#action01]
   [NEW] ACTION: Guus discuss with Sean editors for the SKOS
   implementation report [recorded in
   [41]http://www.w3.org/2009/01/27-swd-minutes.html#action04]
   [NEW] ACTION: SKOS Editors drop "However, the use of mapping
   properties might..." sentence from the primer section 3.1 [recorded
   in [42]http://www.w3.org/2009/01/27-swd-minutes.html#action10]

   [PENDING] ACTION: Ben review RDFa Use Cases and propose transition
   to Group Note [recorded in
   [43]http://www.w3.org/2008/09/30-swd-minutes.html#action02]
   [PENDING] ACTION: Guus to look at OWL documents for review [recorded
   in [44]http://www.w3.org/2008/10/21-swd-minutes.html#action10]
   [PENDING] ACTION: Ralph post his comments on the editor's draft of
   the metadata note [recorded in
   [45]http://www.w3.org/2008/11/25-swd-minutes.html#action03]
   [PENDING] ACTION: Ralph to review the revised Recipes draft
   [recorded in
   [46]http://www.w3.org/2008/12/02-swd-minutes.html#action15]
   [PENDING] ACTION: Ralph/Diego to work on Wordnet implementation [of
   Recipes implementations] [recorded in
   [47]http://www.w3.org/2008/01/22-swd-minutes.html#action20]
   [PENDING] ACTION: Sean to report on SKOSED for SKOS implementation
   report [recorded in
   [48]http://www.w3.org/2009/01/06-swd-minutes.html#action10]

     [43] http://www.w3.org/2008/09/30-swd-minutes.html#action02
     [44] http://www.w3.org/2008/10/21-swd-minutes.html#action10
     [45] http://www.w3.org/2008/11/25-swd-minutes.html#action03
     [46] http://www.w3.org/2008/12/02-swd-minutes.html#action15
     [47] http://www.w3.org/2008/01/22-swd-minutes.html#action20
     [48] http://www.w3.org/2009/01/06-swd-minutes.html#action10

   [DONE] ACTION: Guus to report on usage of SKOS in vocabularies at VU
   for SKOS implementation report [recorded in
   [49]http://www.w3.org/2009/01/06-swd-minutes.html#action09]

     [49] http://www.w3.org/2009/01/06-swd-minutes.html#action09

   [End of minutes]
     _____________________________________________________


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