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meeting record: 2005-05-03 RDF-in-XHTML TF telecon

From: Ralph R. Swick <swick@w3.org>
Date: Tue, 03 May 2005 11:32:19 -0400
Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.2.20050503112135.01af47c0@127.0.0.1>
To: public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf@w3.org

The minutes of today's telecon are
http://www.w3.org/2005/05/03-swbp-minutes.html

A text snapshot of revision 1.4 follows.
----

                             SWBPD RDF-in-XHTML TF

3 May 2005

   [2]Agenda

      [2] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf/2005May/0000.html

   See also: [3]IRC log | [4]mail archive

      [3] http://www.w3.org/2005/05/03-swbp-irc
      [4] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf

Attendees

   Present
          Steven Pemberton, Ralph Swick, Ben Adida, Jeremy Carroll

   Regrets
          MarkB

   Chair
          Ben

   Scribe
          Ralph & Ben

Contents

     * [5]Topics
         1. [6]bnode in RDF/A
         2. [7]XHTML2 Last Call status
         3. [8]GRDDL editor
         4. [9]Action Review
         5. [10]scheduling
     * [11]Summary of Action Items

     _________________________________________________________________


   -> [12]previous meeting 2005-04-12

     [12] http://www.w3.org/2005/04/12-swbp-minutes

bnode in RDF/A

   Ben: Mark [13]writes that he may have found a bug in his [14]bnode
   proposal

     [13] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf/2005May/0002.html
     [14] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf/2005Apr/0021.html

   Ben: Mark's proposal is to use ID and about attributes to denote
   bnodes vs. named nodes

   Steven: I thought I had found some internal inconsistencies
   ... I sent [15]mail about this and hoped that Mark would clarify my
   understanding

     [15] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf/2005Apr/0024.html

   Ralph: I haven't yet investigated this fully
   .. I did like where Mark was headed when we talked about it

   Jeremy: I haven't analysed Mark's proposal either

   ACTION: JJC & Ralph analyse Mark's bnode proposal
   [recorded in
   [16]http://www.w3.org/2005/05/03-swbp-minutes.html#action01]

     [16] http://www.w3.org/2005/05/03-swbp-minutes.html#action01

   Jeremy: target to do bnode proposal review by 24 May

XHTML2 Last Call status

   Steven: HTML WG is close to Last Call
   ... we are awaiting a schema; hope to get the schema this week

   ACTION: Ben to Provide RDF/XML examples and english description to
   Steven and Mark (use cases)
   [CONTINUES]

   Steven: I am speaking at the News Standards conference on 24 May
   ... talking about metadata in XHTML2
   ... may show how to do RSS in RDF/A
   ... will put slides in [17]http://www.w3.org/2005/Talks/

     [17] http://www.w3.org/2005/Talks/

   BenA: Creative Commons is very excited about RDF/A -- want it to be a
   standard soon

GRDDL editor

   Ralph: my primary concern, as I wrote in [18]mail, is insufficient
   evidence of community support to work on GRDDL
   ... people are apparently not willing to give it very high priority

     [18] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf/2005May/0003.html

   Jeremy: there is a lot of enthusiasm for RDF/A in HP
   ... HP doesn't believe it will be possible to scrape the current Web
   for metadata in a reliable way
   ... that seems to be the use case for GRDDL

   Ralph: I'm not sure that GRDDL is akin to scraping
   ... I have a bias against scraping, because no guarantee of author's
   intent
   ... the document author may or may not have intended the scraped
   metadata
   ... GRDDL addresses this problem by including some additional markup
   ... that says that the author *did* mean that metadata
   ... what GRDDL really promises is to allow those who design non-RDF
   XML schemas
   ... to extract semantics from their other schemas
   ... CC has expressed interest in GRDDL for pre-XHTML2, where scraping
   is not a good idea

   Ben: Creative Commons did hope for an ability to use non-standard or
   other XML schemas to embed semantics
   ... e.g. other document types that want to use CC licenses but that
   have not bought into RDF yet
   ... CC apparently has the largest interest w/in the current WG to work
   on GRDDL
   ... should I advise CC of the need for additional resources?

   Ralph: Dom and Dan will probably do most of the work
   ... but they need someone from the WG to attend the meetings
   ... it probably needs to be someone who isn't Creative Commons,
   expressing other use cases and interests

   ACTION: Ben to go back to CC and discuss the GRDDL situation
   [recorded in
   [19]http://www.w3.org/2005/05/03-swbp-minutes.html#action03]

     [19] http://www.w3.org/2005/05/03-swbp-minutes.html#action03

   ACTION: Tom Baker and Gavin to get feedback about use of RDF in XHTML
   in their respective communities
   [CONTINUES]

   Ralph: Gavin gave his [20]verbally at the 21 April WG telecon, we
   asked for email

     [20] http://www.w3.org/2005/04/21-swbp-irc#T18-10-07

   ACTION: Ben to talk to Jeremy about HP feedback [DONE]

Action Review

   ACTION: DanBri RDF schema for new XHTML2 namespace elements
   [CONTINUES]

   ACTION: Steven to send email about latest draft of RDF/A included in
   XHTML 2
   [DONE]

   Steven: I thought I'd done this
   ... the [21]latest RDF/A draft is public
   ... there is only one RDF/A draft
   ... the latest XHTML2 editor's draft is not public

     [21] http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/2004/rdf-a.html

   Ben: is RDF/A part of the XHTML2 editor's draft or only in spirit?

   Steven: only in spirit
   ... my intention is that the XHTML2 draft is more precise than the
   October RDF/A draft

   Ralph: so the current editor's draft has the language you expect the
   last call to have?

   Steven: unless you have comments, that's the text that will go into
   last call
   ... the current XHTML2 editor's draft is Member-visible and has the
   expected text

   <Steven> "22.2. Meta and RDF

   <Steven> The metadata attributes can be used to generate RDF
   statements. The attributes rel, rev and property represent predicates.
   The predicate is obtained by concatenating the namespace URI and the
   local part of the Qname of the attribute value. For attribute rel, the
   subject is the about property, and the object is the value of the href
   attribute; for attribute rev, the subject and object roles are
   reversed. For attribute property, the subject is the about property, a

   ACTION: MarkB to email TF with his bnode proposal -- that (1) any node
   with @id is an anonymous node; (2) that an @href with a fragment
   refers to these nodes (like @rdf:nodeID)
   [DONE]

scheduling

   next meeting: 17 May

   Jeremy: regrets for 17 May and 31 May

   Steven: regrets for 24 May

Summary of Action Items

   [NEW] ACTION: Ben to go back to CC and discuss the GRDDL situation
   [recorded in
   [22]http://www.w3.org/2005/05/03-swbp-minutes.html#action03]
   ACTION: Ben to Provide RDF/XML examples and english description to
   Steven and Mark (use cases)
   ACTION: DanBri RDF schema for new XHTML2 namespace elements
   [NEW] ACTION: JJC & Ralph analyse Mark's bnode proposal
   [recorded in
   [23]http://www.w3.org/2005/05/03-swbp-minutes.html#action01]
   ACTION: Tom Baker and Gavin to get feedback about use of RDF in XHTML
   in their respective communities

     [22] http://www.w3.org/2005/05/03-swbp-minutes.html#action03
     [23] http://www.w3.org/2005/05/03-swbp-minutes.html#action01

   [DONE] ACTION: Ben to talk to Jeremy about HP feedback
   [recorded in
   [24]http://www.w3.org/2005/05/03-swbp-minutes.html#action05]
   [DONE] ACTION: MarkB to email TF with his bnode proposal -- that (1)
   any node with @id is an anonymous node; (2) that an @href with a
   fragment refers to these nodes (like @rdf:nodeID)
   [recorded in
   [25]http://www.w3.org/2005/05/03-swbp-minutes.html#action08]
   [DONE] ACTION: Steven to send email about latest draft of RDF/A
   included in XHTML 2
   [recorded in
   [26]http://www.w3.org/2005/05/03-swbp-minutes.html#action07]

     [24] http://www.w3.org/2005/05/03-swbp-minutes.html#action05
     [25] http://www.w3.org/2005/05/03-swbp-minutes.html#action08
     [26] http://www.w3.org/2005/05/03-swbp-minutes.html#action07

   [End of minutes]

     _________________________________________________________________

   $Id: 03-swbp-minutes.html,v 1.4 2005/05/03 15:28:35 swick Exp $
Received on Tuesday, 3 May 2005 15:32:28 GMT

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