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Minutes: HTML A11Y TF Telecon, 12 September 2013

From: Mark Sadecki <mark@w3.org>
Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2013 15:35:38 -0400
Message-ID: <5232178A.2020600@w3.org>
To: HTML A11Y TF Public <public-html-a11y@w3.org>
Hello,

Thanks to everyone who attended the HTML Accessibility Task Force Teleconference today 12 September 2013.
The minutes are available in HTML and plain text below:

HTML:
http://www.w3.org/2013/09/12-html-a11y-minutes.html


TEXT:
    [1]W3C

       [1] http://www.w3.org/

               HTML Accessibility Task Force Teleconference

12 Sep 2013

    See also: [2]IRC log

       [2] http://www.w3.org/2013/09/12-html-a11y-irc

Attendees

    Present
           janina, MarkS, Judy, Cynthia_Shelly, John_Foliot,
           stevef, Suzanne_Taylor

    Regrets
           Leonie, Hober, chaals

    Chair
           Janina_Sajka

    Scribe
           SuzanneT

Contents

      * [3]Topics
          1. [4]Identify Scribe
             http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/index.php?title=Scr
             ibe_List
          2. [5]HTML Mappings Document Update
          3. [6]Alt Edits Review
          4. [7]Longdesc Testing Update
             http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-a11y/2
             013Aug/0062.html
          5. [8]Longdesc LC Comments: Process and Responses
      * [9]Summary of Action Items
      __________________________________________________________

Identify Scribe
[10]http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/index.php?title=Scribe_List

      [10] http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/index.php?title=Scribe_List

    <MarkS> [11]http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/Scribe_List

      [11] http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/Scribe_List

    <scribe> scribe: SuzanneT

    <Judy> [12]http://idpf.org/edupub-2013

      [12] http://idpf.org/edupub-2013

HTML Mappings Document Update

    JS: not ready to published, but was published

    ironing out status of document, wondering whether or not to
    finish consensus process

    status should say aimed at HTML 5.1

    need a second editor

    JB: should complete process, with a note that the document is
    intended to be joinly produced document

    status should be updated per bug that steve f entered

    should we get Mark listed on any of these joint documents, to
    help prevent this type of issue

    <chaals> Sorry folks, I just sent regrets and some comments...

    Group: need to archive some of the editors; okay to drop
    Cynthia? yes

Alt Edits Review

    (if possible, try to say your name when speaking, since i'm
    still learning voices)

    JS: discussion on Aug 1st: conclusion was yes, useful to id
    class of object, such as "logo"

    <MarkS>
    [13]https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=23207 ->
    filed by janina

      [13] https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=23207

    propose to include a number of these like, pie chart, bar
    graph, etc

    <MarkS>
    [14]https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=22854 ->
    david macdonald

      [14] https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=22854

    MS: foound related bug by Dave McDonald

    mark as duplicate

    Mark will add additional classes of images

    JS: perhaps show a few design patterns for how you add the
    classes

    JF: might be in WCAG techniques

    <SteveF>
    [15]http://www.w3.org/html/wg/drafts/html/master/embedded-conte
    nt-0.html#graphical-representations:-charts,-diagrams,-graphs,-
    maps,-illustrations

      [15] http://www.w3.org/html/wg/drafts/html/master/embedded-content-0.html#graphical-representations:-charts

    group: keep these parallel, there's a task force that is
    responsible for WCAG techniques for HTML 5

    oh, sorry JF

    SF: problem with active images, 'logo' might cause folks to
    think this is a link to a logo
    ... the alt-text for active images is the link text which needs
    to be a brief description of the target

    group: logo: links to homepage? but then print icon: prints
    page?

    JS: okay to ask techniques taskforce to take this up

    group: yes, useful

    MarkS: can take this up as an action item

    <MarkS> ACTION: MarkS to follow up with WCAG on providing
    feedback on ALT advise document, specifically on the use of
    class/category info on images, especially when contained within
    hyperlinks. [recorded in
    [16]http://www.w3.org/2013/09/12-html-a11y-minutes.html#action0
    1]

    <trackbot> Created ACTION-194 - Follow up with wcag on
    providing feedback on alt advise document, specifically on the
    use of class/category info on images, especially when contained
    within hyperlinks. [on Mark Sadecki - due 2013-09-19].

Longdesc Testing Update
[17]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-a11y/2013Aug/0062
.html

      [17] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-a11y/2013Aug/0062.html

    2 items on the agenda today - 60 day last call closes on Monday
    - time for comments nearly passed

    1) testing for CR exit

    <MarkS> [18]http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/Longdesc-tests
    -> longdesc test results wiki

      [18] http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/Longdesc-tests

    <MarkS> [19]https://github.com/chaals/longdesc-tests ->
    longdesc tests on github

      [19] https://github.com/chaals/longdesc-tests

    JS: clean up needed, can probably do in next couple weeks, not
    days

Longdesc LC Comments: Process and Responses

    2) need to provide a formal response to these, after
    establishing concensus on our response

    there are five such comments

    <MarkS>
    [20]https://www.w3.org/2006/02/lc-comments-tracker/44061/WD-htm
    l-longdesc-20130716/ -> longdesc comment tracker

      [20] https://www.w3.org/2006/02/lc-comments-tracker/44061/WD-html-longdesc-20130716/

    send candidate resolutions to the list to see if there are any
    objections

    JS: seeking to be exhaustive and thorough documenting both
    concensus and minor opinions

    <MarkS> CN(via email): I propose to make no substantive changes
    in response to the comments, but in response to the comments
    from James Craig I will propose to add a statement to the
    effect that authors should not use longdesc as an excuse for
    not achieving better accessibility with techniques like the use
    of accessible SVG, or MathML instead of pictures of
    mathematical expressions - in such cases longdesc should be
    considered a fallback for old technology.

    JB: is it acceptable to use a description instead of mathML for
    a single bit of math?

    jf: strong reservations on saying that long desc is
    inappropriate
    ... concerned how we convey this. for example, saying use SVG
    can be a problem, since support is poor
    ... should avoid negative comments

    ST: often we use longdesc to include MathML

    jf: this could be an attempt at weakening longdesc, but the
    word 'inappropriate' is subjective

    JB: helpful to focus on alternate response & wording

    JS: better to talk about what we encourage and recognize that
    there are many ways to achieve appropriate markup
    ... spec is not the place for author guidance on choosing what
    to do
    ... positive not negative, support many ways/options, point to
    other W3C guidance

    jf: can live with that, believe it belongs in WCAG techniques
    document

    CS: what about a see also link to other options, instead of
    making a judgement

    JB: perhaps handle in techniques layers, but have to get the
    timing to work better

    JS: Is there an appropriate use of longdesc instead of mathML
    or instead of SVG?

    two considerations: developer learning curve & user learning
    curve (download mathplayer, etc)

    the tutorial folks have raised this question and need an answer

    jf: educational folks were concerned because Google Chrome was
    supposed to supply native support, but it was dropped

    <JF> ACTION: JF to contact edu folks re: MathML support and
    failure status in 2 weeks [recorded in
    [21]http://www.w3.org/2013/09/12-html-a11y-minutes.html#action0
    2]

    <trackbot> Created ACTION-195 - Contact edu folks re: mathml
    support and failure status in 2 weeks [on John Foliot - due
    2013-09-19].

    JS: proposed response to very specific requirements for
    longdesc implementations: allow developers to be creative
    because

    there is room for improvements

Summary of Action Items

    [NEW] ACTION: JF to contact edu folks re: MathML support and
    failure status in 2 weeks [recorded in
    [22]http://www.w3.org/2013/09/12-html-a11y-minutes.html#action0
    2]
    [NEW] ACTION: MarkS to follow up with WCAG on providing
    feedback on ALT advise document, specifically on the use of
    class/category info on images, especially when contained within
    hyperlinks. [recorded in
    [23]http://www.w3.org/2013/09/12-html-a11y-minutes.html#action0
    1]

    [End of minutes]
      __________________________________________________________


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Received on Thursday, 12 September 2013 19:35:40 UTC

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