RE: potential users of web services

I might be convinced to agree that XML is required, but from the generic view point, I don't think that SOAP is required. I view RosettaNet as a web service, but it doesn't use SOAP. 

Anne

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Keith Ballinger [mailto:keithba@microsoft.com]
> Sent: Thursday, April 04, 2002 10:31 PM
> To: thomi@di.uoa.gr; www-ws@w3.org; anne@manes.net
> Subject: RE: potential users of web services
> 
> 
> I tend to agree with what this thread has stated. What do you 
> think of Sun's claims (evidently) from this Java One session[1]?
>  
> "Web Services, the session told us, are not necessarily in XML 
> and do not have to use SOAP, they just describe opening up your 
> internal processes."
>  
> Seems to me that SOAP and XML are pretty required to be called a 
> Web service. Otherwise, it's a distributed app, but not the new 
> loosly coupled thing we are all working on.
>  
> Thanks,
> Keith
>  
> [1] http://www.webservicesarchitect.com/content/articles/wiggers03.asp 
> 
>  -----Original Message----- 
>  From: Anne Thomas Manes [mailto:anne@manes.net] 
>  Sent: Thursday, April 04, 2002 5:48 PM 
>  To: Hao He; thomi@di.uoa.gr; www-ws@w3.org 
>  Subject: RE: potential users of web services 
> 
>  +1 
> 
>  I was struggling with that word. I was originally going to 
> call it simply 
>  software -- trying not to  imply any level of granularity, 
> but then I 
>  thought -- well, it might actually be implemented using firmware or 
>  hardware. So I went with the word component. Perhaps it 
> might be best to 
>  call it a unit of work (although I don't want to imply that 
> it supports 
>  transaction semantics). 
> 
>  Anne 
> 
>  > -----Original Message----- 
>  > From: www-ws-request@w3.org 
> [mailto:www-ws-request@w3.org]On Behalf Of 
>  > Hao He 
>  > Sent: Thursday, April 04, 2002 7:35 PM 
>  > To: 'Anne Thomas Manes'; thomi@di.uoa.gr; www-ws@w3.org 
>  > Subject: RE: potential users of web services 
>  > 
>  > 
>  > I agree most with Anne except one tiny bit: 
>  > 
>  > I would say that a web service is a service provided by 
> one or more 
>  > components that exposes 
>  > a programmatic interface.  A compoent itself is not the service. 
>  > Service is 
>  > the functionality that defined in the interface. 
>  > 
>  > 
>  > Hao 
>  > 
>  > -----Original Message----- 
>  > From: Anne Thomas Manes [mailto:anne@manes.net] 
>  > Sent: Friday, April 05, 2002 5:05 AM 
>  > To: thomi@di.uoa.gr; www-ws@w3.org 
>  > Subject: RE: potential users of web services 
>  > 
>  > 
>  > Thomi, 
>  > 
>  > Ask five people the definition of "web service" and you'll get 
>  > six answers. 
>  > 
>  > I generally describe a web service as a service that 
> communicates over the 
>  > web. A service is a component that exposes a programmatic 
> interface. The 
>  > service interface must be described; and the service 
>  > implementation must be 
>  > discoverable. 
>  > 
>  > When you relate this abstract definition to current 
> technologies, you can 
>  > implement a web service by creating a service that exposes a SOAP 
>  > interface, 
>  > which is described by WSDL, and which is registered in UDDI. But 
>  > I wouldn't 
>  > want to use current technologies to *define* the basic concept. I 
>  > also don't 
>  > think that it's essential to use any of these 
> technologies to create a web 
>  > service. I can certainly create a web service using XML-RPC or 
>  > RosettaNet or 
>  > a host of other technologies. 
>  > 
>  > That said, I would concur that web services are intended 
> to be consumed by 
>  > applications rather than humans. But keep in mind that a 
> user interface is 
>  > an application. If I wanted to arrange food for 500 people for 
>  > two weeks in 
>  > Dubai, I would use a catering application, which in turn 
> uses web services 
>  > to find caterers that can provide services in Dubai. The 
> UI isn't the web 
>  > service. The UI uses web services to accomplish its work. Hence 
>  > an ASP page 
>  > or HTML form aren't web services, they are an interface 
> to web services. 
>  > 
>  > Best regards, 
>  > 
>  > Anne Thomas Manes 
>  > CTO, Systinet 
>  > 
>  > > -----Original Message----- 
>  > > From: www-ws-request@w3.org [mailto:www-ws-request@w3.org]On 
>  > > Behalf Of Thomi Pilioura 
>  > > Sent: Thursday, April 04, 2002 9:09 AM 
>  > > To: www-ws@w3.org 
>  > > Subject: potential users of web services 
>  > > 
>  > > 
>  > > Hi all, 
>  > > 
>  > > I'm little confused about the notion of the term "web 
> services". 
>  > > When I'm reading papers related to UDDI,WSDL,SOAP they present 
>  > > web services 
>  > > as a new age of distributed computing and as such they are only 
>  > useful to 
>  > > developers (who are trying to build web applicattions) 
> and not to the 
>  > > end-users. But when I'm reading papers related to 
> DAML-S the idea I'm 
>  > > getting for web services is different. They are also useful to 
>  > > end users as 
>  > > it shown by DAML-S motivating scenarios: 
>  > > 
>  > > Web service discovery 
>  > > Find me a shipping service that transports goods to Dubai. 
>  > > 
>  > > Web service invocation 
>  > > Buy me 500 lbs. powdered milk from www.acmemoo.com 
>  > > 
>  > > Web service selection, composition and interoperation 
>  > > Arrange food for 500 people for 2 weeks in Dubai. 
>  > > 
>  > > Web service execution monitoring 
>  > > Has the powdered milk been ordered and paid for yet? 
>  > > 
>  > > There are also numerous papers that use the term 
> service (and not "web 
>  > > service") and are talking about UDDI, WSDL and DAML-S. 
> What's the 
>  > > difference 
>  > > between "web service" and "service" if both of them work over 
>  > > Internet? For 
>  > > example, a search engine (such as google) is a service, 
> but when it is 
>  > > described in WSDL, published in UDDI and can be invoked using 
>  > > SOAP becomes a 
>  > > web service? Ia a asp or an HTML form a service or a 
> web service? 
>  > > 
>  > > In summary which are the potential users of web 
> services (web service 
>  > > providers, developers, end-users)? 
>  > > 
>  > > could you please shed some light on this? 
>  > > regards 
>  > > Thomi Pilioura 
>  > > 
>  > > 
>  > > 
>  > > 
>  > 
>

Received on Friday, 5 April 2002 00:23:43 UTC