RE: D-AG004: Ensures platform independence

Supporting heterogeneity requires supporting multiple programming and
scripting languages. Stating that we need to "adopt the use of platform
independent languages such as Java" to help ensure that we allow for the
use of multiple programming models is a bit of an oxymoron. For true
platform and language independence, we must avoid requiring the details
or object model of Java or any other programming language to "show
through" at the Web Services level.
 
--steve

-----Original Message-----
From: Abbie Barbir [mailto:abbieb@nortelnetworks.com]  
Sent: Tuesday, March 19, 2002 10:49 AM
To: michael.mahan@nokia.com; Austin.D@ic.grainger.com
Cc: www-ws-arch@w3.org; Christopher Ferris
Subject: RE: D-AG004: Ensures platform independence


Mike and all,
 
Per the last teleconference call D-AG004 is still open and must be
closed by the next call.
In this e-mail I attempt to close the issues regarding the design Goal.
The goal as stated 
" 
D-AG0004 
ensures platform independence of web services components in a way that
does not preclude any programming model nor assume any particular mode
of communication between the individual components 

"

In my original e-mail I have riased some issues regarding the goal, but
unfortunatly I did not get good track.
 
So here are my $.002,
 
Discussion:
------------------
 
In order to ensure platform independence, we need the following:
1. Adopt the use of platform independent languages such as JAVA. 
2. Have very well defined interfaces to web components that are general
and could be invoked using appropriate protocols.
3. Try to use XML and other markup techniques that ensures the ability
to invoke web components using variaty of protocols.
 
 
The design goal can coexist with D-AG0003: is sufficiently extensible
and  with D-AG0005:provides simplicity and ease-of-use that does not
impose high barriers to entry for users of web services. In my opnion,
the appropriate designs for platform independence interfaces can help
the above two stated golas.
 
 
Furtheremore, Some issues were raised regarding the interdependecne of
D-AG004 and D-AG011. Here D-AG011 is restated:
 
CURRENT GOAL STATEMENT: 
Web Services are consistent with the existing web and its heterogenous
environment and distributed architecture to the greatest extent
possible.
 
Discussion -2:
-------------------
 
I really do think that the requirement of platform independence does
contradict the above design goal. In my view designing for platform
independence must be consistant with D-AG011. So in this regard, D-AG011
can feed into D-AG004.
 
Crtitical Success Factors:
----------------------------------
 
The design goal can be achieved through the insistance on using platform
independent development tools and languages such as XML and JAVA. The
interfaces to web components must also be properly designed.
 
Derived Requirements:
--------------------------------
1. Consistent definition of web components
2. Good definition of web components Interfaces.
3. Use XML based protocols for invoking the web components.
 
 
Current Recommendation:
--------------------------------------
The goal should stay as written
 
 
cheers
abbie
 
 



-----Original Message-----
From: michael.mahan@nokia.com [mailto:michael.mahan@nokia.com]
Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2002 10:48 AM
To: Austin.D@ic.grainger.com; Barbir, Abbie [CAR:1A00:EXCH]
Cc: www-ws-arch@w3.org
Subject: RE: D-AG004: Ensures platform independence


Hi Abbie,
 
In message [1], I questioned whether platform independence goal is
separate from D-AG0011. Can you comment on that.
 
Thx, Mike
 
 
[1]  <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-ws-arch/2002Mar/0181.html>
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-ws-arch/2002Mar/0181.html

-----Original Message-----
From: ext Austin, Daniel [mailto:Austin.D@ic.grainger.com]
Sent: March 12, 2002 05:41 PM
To: 'Abbie Barbir'
Cc: 'www-ws-arch@w3.org'
Subject: RE: D-AG004: Ensures platform independence


Hi Abbie,
 
    The text of this goal was quoted directly from the group charter, so
we have to be careful about amending it. But I think these are good
questions. What are the answers?
 
Regards,
 
D-

-----Original Message-----
From: Abbie Barbir [mailto:abbieb@nortelnetworks.com]
Sent: Tuesday, March 12, 2002 1:19 PM
To: www-ws-arch@w3.org
Cc: Abbie Barbir
Subject: D-AG004: Ensures platform independence




This message kicks off discussion on goal 4, "ensures platform
independence of web services" 

Please comment on goal wording, success factors, relation to other
goals, etc. 

The goal as stated 
" 
D-AG0004 
ensures platform independence of web services components in a way that
does not preclude any programming model nor assume any particular mode
of communication between the individual components 

" 

Discussion: 
-------------- 
I think that the goal as stated provides a nobel idea that software
designers would like to comply with. However, it seems to me that 

1. A proper definition of the term components must be provided, where
the line would be drawn on where and how the platform idependence could
be achieved.

2. In addition, does plateform independence means the independence from
the actual operating system and/or programming language. 

3. In order to be able not to preclude any programming model, what kind
of interface do we assume for web services components?

4. In order not to assume any mode of communications between the
individual components, how would data be exchanged (if need be ?)


Other issues: 
------------- 

5. Is this redundant with D-AG0003: is sufficiently extensible to allow
for future evolution of technology and of business goals 

 when combined with D-AG0005:provides simplicity and ease-of-use that
does not impose high barriers to entry for users of web services 

Critical success factors 
------------------------ 

How platform independence could be measured, verified and achieved? and
who will verify that? 

cheers 
abbie