Minutes, 15 September 2016 SVG WG telcon

https://www.w3.org/2016/09/15-svg-minutes.html

And as text:
   [1]W3C

      [1] http://www.w3.org/

                               - DRAFT -

                    SVG Working Group Teleconference

15 Sep 2016

   [2]Agenda

      [2] https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-svg/2016Sep/0011.html

   See also: [3]IRC log

      [3] http://www.w3.org/2016/09/15-svg-irc

Attendees

   Present
          nikos, Tav, stakagi, shepazu, AmeliaBR

   Regrets
   Chair
          Nikos

   Scribe
          nikos

Contents

     * [4]Topics
         1. [5]SVG 2 CR publication update
         2. [6]TPAC meeting plans
         3. [7]New charter
         4. [8]'typographic character' should mention grapheme
            clusters
         5. [9]* UTF-16 code points for addressable characters
         6. [10]Inline-blocks in text
     * [11]Summary of Action Items
     * [12]Summary of Resolutions
     __________________________________________________________

   <stakagi> hi!

   <shepazu> SVG published as CR! [13]https://www.w3.org/TR/SVG2/

     [13] https://www.w3.org/TR/SVG2/

   <scribe> scribe: nikos

   <scribe> scribenick: nikos

SVG 2 CR publication update

   <stakagi> Congratulations!

   shepazu: yay!
   ... I've started reaching out to people to help with testing as
   invited experts
   ... [14]https://github.com/karip

     [14] https://github.com/karip

   <shepazu> [15]https://twitter.com/_hmig

     [15] https://twitter.com/_hmig

   <shepazu>
   [16]http://w3c.github.io/svgwg/specs/svg-authoring/#new-feature
   s-in-svg-2

     [16] http://w3c.github.io/svgwg/specs/svg-authoring/#new-features-in-svg-2

   shepazu: Also I updated the authoring the guide - added
   foreignObject and this
   ... it's a loaded question - should we add new features from
   svg 2 into this authoring guide?

   nikos: If you can't author with them yet, do they belong in the
   authoring guide?

   shepazu: that's one of the cons

   AmeliaBR: definitely they could be written up as how you can
   use these features in a progressive enhancement way - a
   practical guide of where we are now
   ... things can become dated if discussion is focused on current
   browser support so we should have a periodic review and update
   planned

   shepazu: it doesn't actually have to be part of the authoring
   guide

   <AmeliaBR>
   [17]https://help.github.com/articles/configuring-a-publishing-s
   ource-for-github-pages/

     [17] https://help.github.com/articles/configuring-a-publishing-source-for-github-pages/

   AmeliaBR: There's a way to host on github pages directy from
   master - for us it makes sense to just do this

TPAC meeting plans

   [18]https://github.com/w3c/svgwg/wiki/TPAC-2016-Agenda

     [18] https://github.com/w3c/svgwg/wiki/TPAC-2016-Agenda

   nikos: We plan to meet for a single day on Thursday
   ... hopefully we'll have someone from web platform tests
   ... come along to our testing session
   ... and i've started raising issues regarding testing so keep
   an eye on those

New charter

   <AmeliaBR>
   [19]https://w3c.github.io/charter-drafts/svg-2016.html

     [19] https://w3c.github.io/charter-drafts/svg-2016.html

   <shepazu>
   [20]https://w3c.github.io/charter-drafts/svg-2016.html

     [20] https://w3c.github.io/charter-drafts/svg-2016.html

   Tav: how do things like the stroking spec fit into this?

   AmeliaBR: we are probably not going to get substantial work
   done on them

   nikos: one thing we may want to do is publish new working
   drafts with status updates

   <AmeliaBR> [21]https://svgwg.org/

     [21] https://svgwg.org/

   [22]https://svgwg.org/specs/markers/

     [22] https://svgwg.org/specs/markers/

   [23]https://svgwg.org/specs/paths/

     [23] https://svgwg.org/specs/paths/

   [24]https://svgwg.org/specs/strokes/

     [24] https://svgwg.org/specs/strokes/

   shepazu: they've all been published as FPWD. Why did we split
   them out?

   nikos: Mainly as a holding ground for features removed from SVG
   2

   shepazu: there's two reasons for modularity - incremental
   change and reusability
   ... so they provide incremental change and we don't reference
   them from svg 2?

   AmeliaBR: yes - they are planned to replace the chapters for
   svg 2

   shepazu: are these specs planning to be reused in css or
   anything else?

   Tav: markers is more organisational - strokes the css group is
   interested in

   AmeliaBR: paths could be general and reused by svg, css, and
   canvas

   shepazu: is it reusable by css and canvas the way it's written
   now?

   AmeliaBR: right now it's written for svg

   shepazu: so if we were going to make it as a stand alone spec -
   we would have to do that
   ... are we planning on having them as seperate deliverables
   permanently? or is it something that should be folded back into
   svg 3?

   AmeliaBR: my goal is to make svg 3 modular

   nikos: I agree that's a good plan - and generally I think that
   was the working groups plan

   Tav: agree - that was what we'd talked about before

   shepazu: that may require some substantial rewriting because of
   the way the chapters are linked together
   ... ok I'll add these to the charter
   ... but note that they are not the priority for the svg 2
   timeframe

   <stakagi> I would like to, still pursue feasibility of Levels
   of details.

   shepazu: is there a draft spec for Level of details? Before we
   add a spec to the charter for the next year we really need to
   have a draft published

   Tav: how long is this charter period?

   shepazu: this charter period is one year - intended to get us
   through the publication of svg 2
   ... we're not doing things in this charter period for svg 3
   ... the degree to which we get stuff done this year will inform
   w3c management about how feasible continued work by the svg wg
   will be
   ... I think zoom and level of details is useful, but right now
   we don't have anybody actively editing it so I didn't include
   it
   ... that's not to say you can't work on it
   ... if you put together a spec over the year then it could be
   included in the next charter
   ... this charter is just a placeholder for continuing the work
   that we're actively doing right now
   ... I don't want to put things in scope for this charter unless
   we have a spec that is being actively worked on
   ... some fx specs that we're not so active on are included
   because the css wg is working on them and it's listed in their
   charter

   nikos: is that acceptable takagi-san? You are most welcome to
   continue work on level of detail. We just won't plan it as a
   deliverable over the next year. But the group will recharter in
   one year or perhaps sooner.

'typographic character' should mention grapheme clusters

   [25]https://github.com/w3c/svgwg/issues/262

     [25] https://github.com/w3c/svgwg/issues/262

   nikos: this is basically about where we have a definition in
   the svg 2 spec
   ... but there's also a definition in css
   ... so my thoughts are that we should totally remove the
   definition from svg 2 and have one definition in css

   Tav: I don't like that idea because it makes reading the spec
   harder
   ... I wouldn't mind saying the normative definition is in css
   ... there is a link to the css definition there

   nikos: in that case I think we should format the definition as
   a note rather than a normative block of text
   ... could we have two sections - css definitions used in this
   chapter (which is non normative)
   ... with a second section for new definitions

   AmeliaBR: I like the idea of having a definition in svg, with a
   link to the normative definition in css
   ... could be as simple as saying 'as defined in ... '

   Tav: so looking at 'character' - is that ok?

   AmeliaBR: yes

   nikos: it's more an issue where we've copied blocks of text
   from css, but not grabbed the whole definition
   ... so lets keep the definitions but make it clear that css is
   the normative definition. we can tidy up the writing to clarify
   this

* UTF-16 code points for addressable characters

   [26]https://github.com/w3c/svgwg/issues/259

     [26] https://github.com/w3c/svgwg/issues/259

   so this one is backwards compatibility issue? We agree and we
   know the issue exists, but we're sticking with backwards
   compatibility with svg 1.1

   Tav: it's more it was defined in dom 2
   ... it's not that we decided to use utf 16 code units, but dom
   2 did

   AmeliaBR: and it's not something we can change because it could
   break content
   ... it would be nice to have some sort of switch

   Tav: i wonder how much utf 16 is used

   AmeliaBR: it doesn't matter how the encoding is - it takes
   whatever encoding you use, and it counts it as if it were utf
   16
   ... so if you've got something where you're positioning emoji
   that are multi byte you're going to have extra numbers in the
   dx,dy string

   Tav: not sure what is meant by surrogate character

   nikos: that would be a character that depends on another - say
   an accent that's defined with a second code point but can't be
   split from it's dependent
   ... Tav are you happy to go through these issues and do editing
   where we need to?

   Tav: yes

   <AmeliaBR> [27]https://github.com/w3c/svgwg/issues/273

     [27] https://github.com/w3c/svgwg/issues/273

Inline-blocks in text

   AmeliaBR: we don't support inline block layout so that has
   potential for a situation where we don't have a defined
   behaviour

   Tav: we were going to hold that off for a future version

   <AmeliaBR> [28]https://github.com/w3c/svgwg/issues/275

     [28] https://github.com/w3c/svgwg/issues/275

   <stakagi> Mr. Shimizu of my substitute will attends svgwg TPAC.

Summary of Action Items

Summary of Resolutions

   [End of minutes]

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Received on Friday, 16 September 2016 00:06:21 UTC