- From: Tavmjong Bah <tav.w3c@gmail.com>
- Date: Sat, 01 Feb 2014 17:38:35 +0100
- To: robert@ocallahan.org
- Cc: Erik Dahlstrom <ed@opera.com>, "www-svg@w3.org" <www-svg@w3.org>
On Sun, 2014-02-02 at 01:01 +1300, Robert O'Callahan wrote: > On Fri, Jan 31, 2014 at 5:13 AM, Erik Dahlstrom <ed@opera.com> wrote: > shepazu: I think there could be some value at republishing > at > W3C > ... second question is, since we are killing off SVG fonts, > for > those browsers who decided to never do SVG fonts, that's > good > news > ... there's a chance we'll see this new SVG glyphs in other > browsers since they already do OpenType > ... with the shitty internationalization of the old SVG > Fonts, > it was reasonable for them not to implement it > ... what I hated about SVG Fonts was the inverted > coordinate > system > ... is there any possibility for us resurrecting SVG Fonts > in a > way, by embedding an OpenType font in the document? > > ChrisL: the XML serialization of OT, UFO, is very verbose > ... the binary format is very compact, lots of tables with > bytes > ... by the way, WOFF is a way to wrap up any sfnt font > > Tav: would it be possible to have the table information in > the > font, but feed in the SVG glyphs to it? > > ChrisL: that would be interesting > ... there is a demo of that, but it's kind of hacky > ... roc made it. you load in an OpenType font, and gives > you a > textarea to enter some SVG, wraps it up and sticks it into > the > table, generates an OpenType font > > > You were referring to > https://github.com/rocallahan/svg-opentype-workshop. Naturally I don't > think this solution is hacky :-). OpenType is just a binary format; > it's a little harder for JS to stuff SVG content into than if it were > XML, but it's not different in kind. That code is not complex. I > honestly think this is a solved problem and we won't need any browser > API for manipulating font data. > > > Tav: I tried to do this with inkscape, but I ran into > trouble > since we use Pango for text layout, which doesn't let you > insert a user font > ... I was going to intercept the layout information from > Pango, > and just draw the SVG glyph > > ChrisL: I should say, Behdad Esfabod has been at these > meetings > and is aware of this > ... and is interested in adding this to Harfbuzz > > > I don't know what needs to be added to Harfbuzz. Harfbuzz is designed > to handle shaping and leaves glyph rendering to the application, so > choosing to rendering some glyphs via SVG doesn't require changes to > Harfbuzz. I suppose Harfbuzz could add an API to read the SVG glyphs > directory but that's very simple stuff. > > > shepazu: maybe not right now, but this is a useful use case > to > pursue in the future > > Tav: yeah. it's a way of getting your cake and eating it > too. > ... basically saying OpenType handles all the nasty i18n > layout > stuff, and we provide a glyph > > > Yes, that separation between shaping and glyph rendering is assumed by > Harfbuzz (and by Cairo before it, and elsewhere). Yes, that is true. We (Inkscape) render the paths ourselves. The problem is that Inkscape relies on Cairo/Pango for laying out text. At the moment Pango only makes available to Inkscape fonts that are already installed on the system. We cannot include a font (SVG or OpenType) in an SVG file, extract it, and then insert it into the list of fonts Pango knows about. There was some discussion a few years ago and some a bit of work to make this possible but it is far from complete.[1][2] I started down the path of finishing the work but quickly ran into problems. Tav [1] http://lists.cairographics.org/archives/cairo/2008-April/013698.html [2] https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=347237
Received on Saturday, 1 February 2014 16:39:06 UTC