- From: Anthony Grasso <anthony.grasso@cisra.canon.com.au>
- Date: Wed, 28 Oct 2009 19:23:04 +1100
- To: www-svg@w3.org
http://www.w3.org/2009/10/28-svg-minutes.html --- [1]W3C [1] http://www.w3.org/ - DRAFT - SVG Working Group Teleconference 28 Oct 2009 See also: [2]IRC log [2] http://www.w3.org/2009/10/28-svg-irc Attendees Present ed, Doug_Schepers, anthony, jwatt Regrets Chair Erik Scribe anthony Contents * [3]Topics 1. [4]Telcon Times 2. [5]SVG Full 1.1 Marathon 3. [6]Rendering Order and Z-Index proposal 4. [7]list collection 5. [8]CSS pseudo classes for <a> * [9]Summary of Action Items _________________________________________________________ <trackbot> Date: 28 October 2009 <ed> [10]http://mcc.id.au/2007/03/telcon/ [10] http://mcc.id.au/2007/03/telcon/ <scribe> Scribe: anthony Telcon Times DS: I see 20:00 UTC ED: That would be 21:00 for Chris and me AG: That would be 8:00am following day for me DS: Marked 18:30 on Monday as bad ... no wait just double checking ... we talked about 19:00 to 20:30 UTC ... Chris marked 19:00 to 20:30 UTC as best and then good ... for him that would be 20:00 to 21:30 UTC + 1 ED: I would prefer to start 20:30 UTC + 1 <ed> ...or better still 21:00 UTC+1 DS: Chris has that for Monday and Thursday as good and best ... for me that would be ... 15:00 my time AG: So for me that would be 7am the following day which is fine DS: Starting at 20:00 UTC and going for an hour and a half ... one thing Chris said wanted to have a block of time ... before and after ... for getting together to do work ... we could have this as an understood convention ... that this is going on ... and is time to use for actions ... just a convention to follow, more for him ... I'll probably do the same thing ED: Did we want to go for two telcons or one DS: I think we should go for two ... so lets go ahead and block off those times ... just incase ED: That would be Monday and Thursday 20:00 UTC RESOLUTION: We will change telephone conference times to Monday and Thursday 20:00 UTC <scribe> ACTION: Erik to Email the change of telephone conference times to the group and update the wiki page with the new times [recorded in [11]http://www.w3.org/2009/10/28-svg-minutes.html#action01] <trackbot> Created ACTION-2687 - Email the change of telephone conference times to the group and update the wiki page with the new times [on Erik Dahlström - due 2009-11-04]. DS: Chris and I will not be at the telcon next week ... because we will be at TPAC ED: So the new times will be active the week after next ... I think it's Monday 9th ... Doug you will make sure Zakim knows the new times as well? DS: I'll change that now SVG Full 1.1 Marathon ED: Should we start off with having a telcon ... or is it fine to do the work normal office hours? ... for me it will be fine to have a telcon at the time we usually have ... just to start off DS: I'm not fussed either way ED: Try to be available on IRC and try to be available for a small telcon will be good ... I pretty much know what I need to do anyway ... I thought I'd move some of the tests from the old errata location ... to the test suite ... we have some tests there that cover some things that are not tested at the moment ... we need to do some more reviewing of tests ... and make sure the Java binding appendix goes in AG: Do we want the svgweb version to be available as a local version only or as a web version or both? ED: It would be convenient to have the svgweb version as an online reference ... if you have time you can do both Rendering Order and Z-Index proposal ED: I guess we could discuss it but Chris and JWatt are not here DS: I saw JWatt's proposal ... and it seemed reasonable ... I'm not totally convinced it covers all the use cases we have ... Andrew's doesn't seem like it has effective preventions for abuse ... JWatt's provide a consistent method for resolving complicated cases ... I think that if we do this ... we should caution people to use this sparingly ... and talk about cases with hit testing ED: cases I've seen this pop up is pseudo 3D DS: We should also think of this in the context of 3D Transforms ... we should look at tightly integrating this with 3D Transforms ... I personally like the idea that z-index would be the name of the property ... I think people who are using z-index from HTML and CSS will know what they are looking for ED: Being able to move elements in the tree ... without taking them out of the tree ... is useful ... it gives you z-index type benefits for some operations DS: I think it's orthogonal, both are useful ED: It doesn't complicate the rendering model ... but I guess people want z-index anyway DS: It only works when using scripting ... this sounds like something for DOM 4, like what happens when you move an element - do you reload it ... I think the best thing to do is move forward on z-index with the CSS ... this is something to think about this for 3D Transforms anyway ... when you are structuring documents specifying things in z-index can be very useful ... we should stay what happens in the default case that when a transform z puts something behind something else ED: The proposal from JWatt is that being put into spec text? JW: Would it be better to put it into something ... instead of it's own stand alone document ... seems a bit weird to have a single property in it's own document DS: Let's say that we have this single property defined if an implementer wanted to do SVG 1.1 + this ... that would permit them to do so ... they could say we implement SVG 1.1 and this JW: What's the difference to them taking it out of a spec ... and saying they just do that ... feature? DS: People will want very clear conformance criteria to say they support a particular spec JW: As an implementer I can see the bits and I put it together ... but as an author it's difficult ... having picking and choosing things can make things worse ... for example people might just implement it because it's part of spec DS: What about putting it into 3D Transforms? JW: Well I'm not opposed to having it as separate spec or putting it somewhere ... I just don't see how it's going to be easier to comment on DS: The more I think about it I think it belongs in compositing ED: Because it affects the rendering model ... it should go into render concepts DS: Certainly that's where it should go in 2.0 AG: [rambles on about defining a rendering model spec to bring all the work together] ED: Do we want to start the rendering concepts spec right away ... or do we need to something first? DS: I think that is a very useful level ... start with the rendering model from 1.2 ... reconcile that with 1.1 ... put in rendering index RESOLUTION: We will start writing a rendering concepts specification detailing the rendering model <scribe> ACTION: Jonathan to Begin authoring the rendering concepts specification [recorded in [12]http://www.w3.org/2009/10/28-svg-minutes.html#action02] <trackbot> Created ACTION-2688 - Begin authoring the rendering concepts specification [on Jonathan Watt - due 2009-11-04]. list collection DS: right now you create a list collection and you put it into the newest collection JW: I sent two replies to that ... did you see them? DS: I only saw one of them ED: Forgot to CC Doug ... I would like this feedback to go to the public list JW: We plan to implement what the spec says ... probably do it at the same time we do animation for lists ... code needs to be rewritten for animaiton ED: Doing live objects and removal of objects from previous lists ... there's no extra costs ... you do one you get the other one free JW: My opinion you do it live ... you take one matrix from one list and put it into another list then you have two elements using the same matrix ... you have to tell both elements when one changes ... so if using hundreds of elements this can be a performance hit DS: Seems like you guys both agreed that it's better to do it this way CSS pseudo classes for <a> DS: Do you guys agree that CSS pseudo classes should be supported in SVG? ... even if they aren't ED: They are in Opera ... and in FireFox too JW: Just consistency in the web platform ED: It's a bug if it doesn't work Summary of Action Items [NEW] ACTION: Erik to Email the change of telephone conference times to the group and update the wiki page with the new times [recorded in [13]http://www.w3.org/2009/10/28-svg-minutes.html#action01] [NEW] ACTION: Jonathan to Begin authoring the rendering concepts specification [recorded in [14]http://www.w3.org/2009/10/28-svg-minutes.html#action02] [End of minutes] _________________________________________________________ Minutes formatted by David Booth's [15]scribe.perl version 1.135 ([16]CVS log) $Date: 2009/10/28 08:21:37 $ _________________________________________________________ [15] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm [16] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/2002/scribe/ Scribe.perl diagnostic output [Delete this section before finalizing the minutes.] This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.135 of Date: 2009/03/02 03:52:20 Check for newer version at [17]http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002 /scribe/ [17] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/ Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00) Succeeded: s/fire/first/ Succeeded: s/removal of lists/removal of objects from previous lists/ Succeeded: s/2/too/ Succeeded: s/even though they aren't/even if they aren't/ Found Scribe: anthony Inferring ScribeNick: anthony Default Present: ed, Doug_Schepers, anthony, jwatt Present: ed Doug_Schepers anthony jwatt Found Date: 28 Oct 2009 Guessing minutes URL: [18]http://www.w3.org/2009/10/28-svg-minutes.html People with action items: erik jonathan [18] http://www.w3.org/2009/10/28-svg-minutes.html End of [19]scribe.perl diagnostic output] [19] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm
Received on Wednesday, 28 October 2009 08:23:48 UTC