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RE: [SVGMobile12] Resolution of issue SVGT12-487 not satisfactory

From: Doug Schepers <doug.schepers@vectoreal.com>
Date: Mon, 14 Aug 2006 00:25:31 -0400
To: "'Sjoerd Visscher'" <sjoerd@w3future.com>, <www-svg@w3.org>
Message-Id: <20060814042536.A21BC4B9BC@postalmail-a3.dreamhost.com>

Hi, Sjoerd-

Thanks for this analysis and explanation.  Speaking for myself, I would be
much happier were we to align with HTML UA behavior in this regard as much
as possible.  I find your and Maciej's remarks technically compelling.  As
an author, I would expect the kind of behavior Maciej describes.


Sjoerd Visscher wrote:
| It looks like this whole discussion is based on a misunderstanding of 
| the WebCGM spec [1]. The WebCGM spec and the de-facto HTML 
| standard are 
| not incompatible.
| Especially the clarification given by Chris Lilley in [2] is 
| not how I 
| think the WebCGM spec should be read. If Chris had been right, then 
| there would have been no reason for the WebCGM spec to say 
| that _replace 
| only applies to CGM-to-CGM, as it would have been very useful 
| for a CGM 
| file loaded in an iframe.
| _replace is used in WebCGM for images that are loaded in HTML 
| with the 
| img element. In CGM-to-CGM, the link target would be set as the src 
| attribute of the img element. And as HTML is not allowed as image 
| format, _replace is not applicable to CGM-to-HTML.
| The problem of reading the WebCGM spec lies in the fact that is 
| undefined what creates a frame. There is no doubt that html frame 
| elements create frames. An iframe does so too (as the name implies).
| There only remains one problem, the object tag. Does it 
| create a frame?
| I did some test, by loading an image, an html document and an svg 
| document in an object element. Internet Explorer always 
| creates a frame. 
| Firefox does not create a frame for an image, but does so for 
| html and 
| svg. Opera creates a frame for html, but not for images or svg. 
| (Although I'm not so sure about SVG, as Opera does not seem 
| to create a 
| frame for an SVG file in an Iframe either.)
| This explains why Boris Zbarsky was confused by the meaning 
| of _replace, 
| because Firefox always creates a frame for svg content, so _replace 
| never applies and always means the same as _self.
| There is one other thing: if the HTML elements and the SVG 
| elements are 
| in the same document, and the link points to another SVG 
| document, then 
| _replace could mean that the root SVG element is replaced *in 
| the DOM* 
| by the documentElement of the targeted SVG document. (A kind 
| of XInclude 
| operation.) This probably creates more problems than it solves and 
| _replace should in this case do the same as _self.
| [1] http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-WebCGM/REC-03-CGM-IC.html#webcgm_3_1_2_2
| [2] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-svg/2006Jul/0031.html
| -- 
| Sjoerd Visscher
| http://w3future.com/weblog/
Received on Monday, 14 August 2006 04:25:59 UTC

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