- From: Joanmarie Diggs <jdiggs@igalia.com>
- Date: Tue, 06 May 2014 16:03:59 -0400
- To: "wai-xtech@w3.org" <wai-xtech@w3.org>
Link: http://www.w3.org/2014/05/06-aapi-minutes.html
Plain text follows:
[1]W3C
[1] http://www.w3.org/
- DRAFT -
Protocols and Formats Working Group Teleconference
06 May 2014
See also: [2]IRC log
[2] http://www.w3.org/2014/05/06-aapi-irc
Attendees
Present
Joseph_Scheuhammer, Bryan_Garaventa, Joanie_Diggs,
David_Bolter, cyns
Regrets
Chair
Joseph_Scheuhammer
Scribe
joanie
Contents
* [3]Topics
1. [4]No meeting next week. Think about what edits
(issues/actions) are most important for next heart
beat draft.
2. [5]ISSUE-481/ACTION-1368 (Cynthia): Investigate IE
implementation of aria-live region events.
3. [6]ACTION-1408 (Joseph): Email Jason Kiss followup re:
AAPI that describes API differences.
4. [7]ISSUE-594: (David, Joanie): tablist has implicit
live region mapping in UIA guide (IA2, ATK).
5. [8]ACTION-1371/ISSUE-618 (Cynthia): Test case for IE
selection on a single selection container when item
becomes unselected.
6. [9]1.1 ISSUES and ACTIONS: (All) Start with
ACTION-842,
https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/842
* [10]Summary of Action Items
__________________________________________________________
<trackbot> Date: 06 May 2014
<clown> agenda: this
<scribe> scribenick: joanie
No meeting next week. Think about what edits (issues/actions) are
most important for next heart beat draft.
JS: There's no meeting next week because I'm on vacation.
... But it has been suggested by the main group that we have a
heart beat draft of all the spec stuff
... And they want that by the end of the month.
... So perhaps while I am away, you all could go through
everything and see if there is anything you want done.
DB: (asks about heart beat draft)
JS: Usually we have done a heart beat draft when we have a
critical mass of things to publish
... The main group seems to be leaning towards every 3 months
... This round, already converted to re-spec, moved to github
... And James Craig has also done a lot
... Let's find things we can agree to quickly and include in
this heart beat
DB: Looking over issues and actions is the easiest
JS: Yes
... We added back the UIA mappings
... We also are adding things Joanie submitted via a comment
... Anything else?
DB: When?
JS: They want to publish by the end of the month.
... When we meet next we need to decide.
... I don't actually publish this; Michael does.
CS: Working Drafts are a work in progress
... But we want to be sure they are ready for the wider
audience
... If we can get a few more issues in there, great; if not,
just be sure it is ready to publish
ISSUE-481/ACTION-1368 (Cynthia): Investigate IE implementation of
aria-live region events.
<clown> ACTION-1368?
<trackbot> ACTION-1368 -- Cynthia Shelly to Investigate
implementation of aria-live region events in ie apropos
issue-481. -- due 2014-04-29 -- OPEN
<trackbot>
[11]https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1368
[11] https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1368
JS: This one was due last week, while I was away.
... It's one of these issues about ARIA Live Regions, removal
events.
... Do you tell the AT ahead of time so that it can report was
removed?
... Both Cynthia and David had an action item
<davidb> my action is 1369
CS: I haven't done it yet
<clown> action-1369?
<trackbot> action-1369 -- David Bolter to Investigate
implementation of aria-live region events in FF -- due
2014-05-06 -- OPEN
<trackbot>
[12]https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1369
[12] https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1369
DB: I think Matt raised it because it is important for some
cases.
<clown> issue-481?
<trackbot> issue-481 -- aria-live removal events should or must
happen before object removal -- open
<trackbot> [13]https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/issues/481
[13] https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/issues/481
DB: I am going to give a long version why we should leave it as
SHOULD.
... For ATs in process, they have access to what is going to be
removed before it is removed from memory
... An additional complication is Firefox is moving to
multiprocess
... AT can only inject into the main process
... Which means they won't be in-process with content
... Which means this issue is going to become moot.
... I cannot speak with certainty until we make this change
... But I don't know if making it a MUST is going to be viable.
... Alex and I are leaning to keeping it a SHOULD.
JS: My feeling is that we need to engage Matt King.
DB: I can follow up
JS: Yes, send him an email referencing the original issue.
... And explaining what Mozilla is doing
DB: I would be curious to know what IE thinks about all this.
action-1368?
<trackbot> action-1368 -- Cynthia Shelly to Investigate
implementation of aria-live region events in ie apropos
issue-481. -- due 2014-04-29 -- OPEN
<trackbot>
[14]https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1368
[14] https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1368
CS: That's not showing up in my open actions.... Oh yes it is.
JS: It is issue 481
<davidb> ACTION: davidb to contact Matt King regarding
issue-481, especially regarding multi-process [recorded in
[15]http://www.w3.org/2014/05/06-aapi-minutes.html#action01]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-1434 - Contact matt king regarding
issue-481, especially regarding multi-process [on David Bolter
- due 2014-05-13].
<clown> action-1434?
<trackbot> action-1434 -- David Bolter to Contact matt king
regarding issue-481, especially regarding multi-process -- due
2014-05-13 -- OPEN
<trackbot>
[16]https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1434
[16] https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1434
JS: We can close 1369
<davidb> BTW FTR here is my note in action 1369 "We'd like to
leave this a SHOULD for now. Ultimately it would be good to
spec this for both in-process and out-of-process AT
interaction. Separately, there is an additional complication in
implementation for multi-process browsers where AT does not
interact directly with the content process."
<clown> close action-1369
<trackbot> Closed action-1369.
ACTION-1408 (Joseph): Email Jason Kiss followup re: AAPI that
describes API differences.
JS: I haven't done it yet.
... This is the whole business of adding a section to the UAIG
... that explains the accessibility APIs
... He shared a long email thread
<clown> action-1408?
<trackbot> action-1408 -- Joseph Scheuhammer to Send email to
jason kiss to ask him if he could write an aapi section that
describes api differences. -- due 2014-05-06 -- OPEN
<trackbot>
[17]https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1408
[17] https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1408
JS: I am going to do this at the end of the month.
... It is not going to be part of the heart beat.
... I want to get a better understanding of what we are talking
about so I can ask the appropriate questions.
... I may get it done before then (June 10th)
ISSUE-594: (David, Joanie): tablist has implicit live region mapping
in UIA guide (IA2, ATK).
<clown> ISSUE-594?
<trackbot> ISSUE-594 -- tablist role has implicit live region
mapping in UIA guide -- raised
<trackbot> [18]https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/issues/594
[18] https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/issues/594
JS: This is one of the ones we can wrap up quickly.
... This is strange, in the mapping tables, Tab Lists for IA2
and ATK/AT-SPI, Tab List is marked as a live region.
... Steven Faulkner suggested we remove this.
<clown> [19]https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=896400
[19] https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=896400
JS: It looks like Firefox has already done the removal.
DB: I think Marco found this behavior annoying
JS: I wanted to check with both of you that this is the right
thing to do.
JD: I agree.
DB: It would be interesting to know how it crept in.
BG: I was wondering if Tab Panel has the same thing.
DB: In Firefox, Tab List and their associated content were not
represented semantically in the tree.
... They were in separate branches.
... One suggestion was to use active descendant. Maybe there
was a mix-up?
<clown> ACTION: Joseph to edit the IA2 and ATK/AT-SPI entries
for role tablist to remove the live region aspects of the
mapping. [recorded in
[20]http://www.w3.org/2014/05/06-aapi-minutes.html#action02]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-1435 - Edit the ia2 and atk/at-spi
entries for role tablist to remove the live region aspects of
the mapping. [on Joseph Scheuhammer - due 2014-05-13].
<clown> action-1435?
<trackbot> action-1435 -- Joseph Scheuhammer to Edit the ia2
and atk/at-spi entries for role tablist to remove the live
region aspects of the mapping. -- due 2014-05-13 -- OPEN
<trackbot>
[21]https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1435
[21] https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1435
ACTION-1371/ISSUE-618 (Cynthia): Test case for IE selection on a
single selection container when item becomes unselected.
<clown> action-1371?
<trackbot> action-1371 -- Cynthia Shelly to Investigate what ie
does for single selection container when item becomes
unselected, and create a test case (issue-618). -- due
2014-04-08 -- OPEN
<trackbot>
[22]https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1371
[22] https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1371
CS: Why don't we say end of May?
... Let's do the 29th.
1.1 ISSUES and ACTIONS: (All) Start with ACTION-842,
[23]https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/842
[23] https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/842
JS: This is triage.
... Let's start at the top and go through them.
<clown> [24]https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=896400
[24] https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=896400
<clown> [25]https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/products/23
[25] https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/products/23
<clown> action-842?
<trackbot> action-842 -- Cynthia Shelly to Create a diagram to
support 1.2 A11Y vs DOM tree -- due 2011-06-21 -- OPEN
<trackbot>
[26]https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/842
[26] https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/842
DB: This is not going to be detailed, correct?
CS: My intention was to make it detailed.
DB: Our accessibility trees aren't the same right?
CS: On this action, I think we should make it a 1.1 action.
... If we don't make it in time, we should remove it.
JS: We'll make it September 2.
CS: (Clarifies the "1.2" in the action refers to the section)
<clown> action-980?
<trackbot> action-980 -- Cynthia Shelly to Define mappings for
managed aria related states: aria-setsize, aria-posinset,
arla-level, focused, focusable with reference to section 5.5
bullet 1 of the UAIG. -- due 2014-05-01 -- OPEN
<trackbot>
[27]https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/980
[27] https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/980
<clown> asdfasdf
<clown> user agents must compute managed states
VISIBLE/INVISIBLE, SHOWING/OFFSCREEN, etc. This typically is
done in the same way as for ordinary elements that do not have
WAI-ARIA attributes present. The FOCUSABLE/FOCUSED states may
be affected by aria-activedescendant. See the rules in
Controlling focus with aria-activedescendant.
<clown>
[28]http://localhost/~clown/GitHub/aria/implementation/aria-imp
lementation.html#mapping_state-property
[28]
http://localhost/~clown/GitHub/aria/implementation/aria-implementation.html#mapping_state-property
CS: Is it adding more detail? Is that what it's asking for?
<clown>
[29]http://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/master/implementation/aria-imple
mentation.html#mapping_state-property
[29]
http://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/master/implementation/aria-implementation.html#mapping_state-property
DB: I guess it's asking us to define how it's done so we come
up with the same thing.
... We have an HTML version (accessibility guide)....
CS: Why do you think it belongs there and not in ARIA?
DB: The language might be similar.
CS: It makes sense to define it in HTML and reference it in
ARIA.
... Add that to the issue.
... Should I do this or should David?
DB: Who is doing the HTML guide
JS: The editors for that guide are Jason Kiss, Alex Surkov,
Steve Faulkner.
<clown>
[30]http://rawgit.com/w3c/html-api-map/master/index.html
[30] http://rawgit.com/w3c/html-api-map/master/index.html
<davidb> I think Alex could help with "This typically is done
in the same way as for ordinary elements that do not have
WAI-ARIA attributes present." for managed state stuff.
JS: I think (the above URL) is what you're talking about.
CS: What it is about... The first bullet has this text
<cyns> this is too vague: "This typically is done in the same
way as for ordinary elements that do not have ARIA "
<davidb> (hmmm or maybe Marco)
<cyns> need to define what is typically done
<davidb> agreed
JS: So it's not specific to aria-setsize, posinset, level...?
CS: Those are the managed states
... The second piece is
<cyns> 2nd piece is to define what ARIA managed states
add/change
DB: This is an action?
JS: 980 is an action.
DB: We assign it maybe?
... I should talk to Alex and Marco first.
JS: I will add a note to the issue for David to discuss this
with Alex and Marco and report back.
<clown> action-1102?
<trackbot> action-1102 -- Joseph Scheuhammer to [ARIA 1.1] Get
someone to look at the SHOULD statements in the Role Mapping
table. Can these be changed from "SHOULD be exposed" to "expose
as" -- due 2014-05-20 -- OPEN
<trackbot>
[31]https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1102
[31] https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1102
JS: This is an edit I have to do.
... There is a list of four things. Exactly what I need to do
is written there.
... I will try to get this done for the heart beat.
DB: Makes sense.
<clown> action-1104?
<trackbot> action-1104 -- Cynthia Shelly to Define what the
accessibility API mapping is for UIA on aria-describedby in
section 5.5.1 table when the element does not exist in the
accessibility tree such as when css: display:none applies --
due 2013-09-17 -- OPEN
<trackbot>
[32]https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1104
[32] https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1104
CS: I may be able to have a conversation about what should be
here (wrt the above issue)
... Let's make it due June 30th.
<clown> action-1263?
<trackbot> action-1263 -- Joseph Scheuhammer to AXARIABusy is
probably going to change to something less ARIA-specific, like
AXBusy or AXElementBusy -- due 2013-12-02 -- OPEN
<trackbot>
[33]https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1263
[33] https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1263
JS: I think this is something I can do.
... It's changing an Apple mapping for aria busy.
... The forking is done so I can go ahead and do this.
... I will add a note to the issue.
... And change the due date to two weeks from now.
yup
didn't know that
sorry
<clown> trackbot, stop
<trackbot> Sorry, clown, I don't understand 'trackbot, stop'.
Please refer to <[34]http://www.w3.org/2005/06/tracker/irc> for
help.
[34] http://www.w3.org/2005/06/tracker/irc%3E
<clown> trackbot, pause
<trackbot> Sorry, clown, I don't understand 'trackbot, pause'.
Please refer to <[35]http://www.w3.org/2005/06/tracker/irc> for
help.
[35] http://www.w3.org/2005/06/tracker/irc%3E
Summary of Action Items
[NEW] ACTION: davidb to contact Matt King regarding issue-481,
especially regarding multi-process [recorded in
[36]http://www.w3.org/2014/05/06-aapi-minutes.html#action01]
[NEW] ACTION: Joseph to edit the IA2 and ATK/AT-SPI entries for
role tablist to remove the live region aspects of the mapping.
[recorded in
[37]http://www.w3.org/2014/05/06-aapi-minutes.html#action02]
[End of minutes]
__________________________________________________________
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Received on Tuesday, 6 May 2014 20:04:42 UTC