RE: A question about immediate feedback

This discussion is pointless. Goodbye.

From: Adam Cooper <cooperad@bigpond.com>
Sent: 27 June 2025 08:47
To: Steve Green <steve.green@testpartners.co.uk>; 'Mark Magennis' <Mark.Magennis@skillsoft.com>; w3c-wai-ig@w3.org
Subject: RE: A question about immediate feedback

Seriously, how do you know that people (the illicit drug trade and information technology industry have one thing in common-  they both have 'users') have consumed and understood simply because they have dismissed a popup ... could be in error, could be because they don't care what it says because it's just in their way, they already know what it's going to tell them, and so on ...  it's a bit like authorship - intention when writing something simply isn't sufficient to guarantee that whatever is written will be interpreted correctly or interpreted at all.

I'm not getting into the SPA V. SSR debate  suffice to say I disagree with your assessment about the accessibility of single page applications.







From: Steve Green <steve.green@testpartners.co.uk<mailto:steve.green@testpartners.co.uk>>
Sent: Friday, June 27, 2025 3:39 PM
To: Adam Cooper <cooperad@bigpond.com<mailto:cooperad@bigpond.com>>; 'Mark Magennis' <Mark.Magennis@skillsoft.com<mailto:Mark.Magennis@skillsoft.com>>; w3c-wai-ig@w3.org<mailto:w3c-wai-ig@w3.org>
Subject: RE: A question about immediate feedback

How do you know the content has been conveyed unless the user explicitly dismisses the message?

Why do you think that loading new pages is a legacy issue? It's how almost the entire web works, apart from the small number of single-page applications. There is a case for using them in certain circumstances, but they are inappropriate for the vast majority of websites. If you want to make the web a far less accessible place, then SPAs are the way to go.

Steve

From: Adam Cooper <cooperad@bigpond.com<mailto:cooperad@bigpond.com>>
Sent: 27 June 2025 02:50
To: Steve Green <steve.green@testpartners.co.uk<mailto:steve.green@testpartners.co.uk>>; 'Mark Magennis' <Mark.Magennis@skillsoft.com<mailto:Mark.Magennis@skillsoft.com>>; w3c-wai-ig@w3.org<mailto:w3c-wai-ig@w3.org>
Subject: RE: A question about immediate feedback

If time limit was normatively defined, I might be inclined to agree, but it isn't so as I said earlier I can see no embargo on items being removed from view automatically once their content has been conveyed ...

and page load to change content is hopefully a bit of a legacy issue, isn't it?




From: Steve Green <steve.green@testpartners.co.uk<mailto:steve.green@testpartners.co.uk>>
Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2025 6:49 PM
To: Mark Magennis <Mark.Magennis@skillsoft.com<mailto:Mark.Magennis@skillsoft.com>>; w3c-wai-ig@w3.org<mailto:w3c-wai-ig@w3.org>
Subject: RE: A question about immediate feedback

I agree about it being a clear violation of 2.2.1 if the messages automatically disappear after a period of time except in the circumstances you describe or if a page reload occurs.

Steve

From: Mark Magennis <Mark.Magennis@skillsoft.com<mailto:Mark.Magennis@skillsoft.com>>
Sent: 26 June 2025 09:38
To: w3c-wai-ig@w3.org<mailto:w3c-wai-ig@w3.org>
Subject: Re: A question about immediate feedback

Adam Cooper said:  "It should be onscreen for as long as you believe it is necessary for everybody to consume its content and then disappear."



Adam, I would have thought that automatically disappearing toast notifications are a violation of 2.2.1 Timing Adjustable. Unless they disappear when they are no longer valid or one of the other mechanisms (turn off, adjust, extend) are implemented.

Interested to hear your view on this.

Mark