Re: Focus onto control that only appears on focus?

Hi Taliesin,

yes these are the kind of questions I was asking myself which is why I
queried this issue.

The control is an AI button on every field in a form that can be clicked to
auto fill in data. It is always in the DOM with opacity 0, but appears
visible when it has focus or it's parent field container has focus, or it's
parent container has a hover state.

It was decided to hide the AI button on all non-focused/non-hovered fields
for aesthetic reasons so we didn't have dozens of AI buttons.

If the above changes any answers re accessibility failure, I would be
interested.

On Wednesday, February 14, 2024, Taliesin Smith <talilief@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi Michael and others,
> I am coming late to this thread, and I am wondering if the question
should be reframed?
> For example, why does the element have zero opacity? What is the context
of the zero opacity? Is the element a control?
> Is the element supposed to be communicating a disabled state (case 1) or
is meant to be hidden all together from everyone (case 2)?
> In case 1, if the element is disabled, it should communicate that state
in a way that is perceivable to everyone.
> In case 2, if the element is completely hidden visually, and meant to be
hidden all together, a visible focus event seems out of context, and if
that focus event is not communicating a hidden or disabled state, I think
there is a mismatch that should constitute a fail of some kind.
> In the example of skip links, I would think the link’s focus outline
should be accompanied by a visually displayed accessible name and with
screen reader software the name and function would be spoken out loud, for
example, “Skip to Main Content, link”.
> I do not do these kinds of reviews, so I am not basing my opinion on
experience with interpreting the guidelines, but in my humble opinion, a
focus link is non-text content and according to 1.1.1
> “If non-text content is a control or accepts user input, then it has
a name that describes its purpose. (Refer to Success Criterion 4.1.2 for
additional requirements for controls and content that accepts user input.)”
> I hope that is helpful.
> Taliesin
> ~.~.~.~.~.~.~.~.~.~.~.~.~.~.~.~.~
> Taliesin L. Smith
> talilief@gmail.com
> taliesin.smith@colorado.edu
>
> Inclusive Design Research Specialist
> PhET Interactive Simulations
> http://phet.colorado.edu/
> Department of Physics
> University of Colorado, Boulder
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Feb 13, 2024, at 00:12, Adam Cooper <cooperad@bigpond.com> wrote:
> Does tabbing/swiping elements with zero opacity work on all platforms? I
seem to recall a browser not focusing elements with zero opacity when
tabbing from the address bar … might be a flashback to IE.
>
>
>
> From: Michael Livesey <mike.j.livesey@gmail.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, February 13, 2024 8:25 AM
> To: Jeremy Echols <jechols@uoregon.edu>
> Cc: WAI Interest Group discussion list <w3c-wai-ig@w3.org>
> Subject: Re: Focus onto control that only appears on focus?
>
> Thanks, Jeremy,
>
> Yes, I totally forgot about skip links good point.
>
> Thanks.
>
> On Monday, February 12, 2024, Jeremy Echols <jechols@uoregon.edu> wrote:
>> I think this is pretty common for skip links and paragraph permalinks a
lot of sites use. I don’t know that it’s even bad UX, but for accessibility
it is definitely *good*, even when it can be a little unexpected.
Always-visible links that only help keyboard users would arguably be worse
UX.
>>
>>
>>
>> From: Michael Livesey <mike.j.livesey@gmail.com>
>> Sent: Monday, February 12, 2024 01:39
>> To: WAI Interest Group discussion list <w3c-wai-ig@w3.org>
>> Subject: Focus onto control that only appears on focus?
>>
>>
>>
>> Hi all,
>>
>>
>>
>> I have a question about focusing onto a control that is opacity: 0 when
not focused.
>>
>>
>>
>> So you hit "Tab" and you are taken to a control that has opacity: 1 set
on its :focus pseudo selector, thus it was invisible and it only appears on
focus.
>>
>> When focused, the control will have a focus ring.
>>
>>
>>
>> I know this isn't ideal UX, but is this disallowed under any criteria
please?
>>
>> Thank you
>