Re: JAWS lists and modal windows

> The difference from the example by Scott O’hara is that it uses aria-modal=”true” with role=”dialog”

Thank you for covering these points; modals are challenging(!) and it seems--at the moment--that there is no one single perfect solution for all cases.

For what it's worth, Scott O’hara ​talks about both the points:


aria-modal=”true”

https://github.com/scottaohara/accessible_modal_window#lack-of-features-are-not-bugs


role=”dialog”
https://github.com/scottaohara/accessible_modal_window#modal-dialog-base-markup



I do not feel qualified to firmly suggest his approach "better", and as he notes time is an issue (as it goes by, support improves), but from what I read it *seemed* that Scott O’hara's approach was also good.


Regards,

Alan
. . . . -   . . - - -
Alan Bristow ( he / him / il )
Web Developer / Développeur Web
Elections Canada / Élections Canada
alan.bristow@elections.ca<mailto:alan.bristow@elections.ca>
+1 873-416-1175
________________________________
From: Ku, JaEun Jemma <jku@uic.edu>
Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2022 9:54 AM
To: Mike Cleary; Léonie Watson
Cc: w3c-wai-ig@w3.org; Matthew King; Gunderson, Jon R (UIUC)
Subject: Re: JAWS lists and modal windows

Ce message a été envoyé par un expéditeur externe. Veuillez faire preuve de prudence et ne pas cliquer sur les liens ou ouvrir les pièces jointes à moins de reconnaître l'expéditeur et de savoir que le contenu est sûr.

This message was sent from an external sender. Please exercise caution and do not click links or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the content is safe.


Here is another modal dialog example from ARIA Authoring Practice Guide<https://www.w3.org/TR/wai-aria-practices-1.2/>. The example has 5 input fields, three other action buttons and one heading.

https://www.w3.org/TR/wai-aria-practices-1.2/examples/dialog-modal/dialog.html


The difference from the example by Scott O’hara is that it uses aria-modal=”true” with role=”dialog”

Best,

JaEun Jemma Ku, PhD<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doctor_of_Philosophy>, PMP<https://www.pmi.org/certifications/project-management-pmp>, ADAC<https://www.adacoordinator.org/>, Section 508 Trusted Tester<https://www.dhs.gov/trusted-tester>
Assistant Director of Digital Accessibility
Co-editor of W3C ARIA APG<https://w3c.github.io/aria-practices/>

Office for Access and Equity <https://oae.uic.edu/> and Technology Solutions<https://it.uic.edu/>
University of Illinois Chicago<https://www.uic.edu/>
Email: jku@uic.edu<mailto:jku@uic.edu>

Pronouns: she/her/hers


From: Mike Cleary <mike.cleary@grantsolutions.gov>
Date: Tuesday, March 29, 2022 5:48 PM
To: Léonie Watson <lwatson@tetralogical.com>
Cc: w3c-wai-ig@w3.org <w3c-wai-ig@w3.org>
Subject: Re: JAWS lists and modal windows
I agree that we are probably weighing down some of our modals with too much information. But one reason we're using modals is because the test team didn't think our tooltips were accessible enough. They were holding us to a WCAG 2.1 standard, although I don't think they realized it.
Our test team tends to take a hardline, letter of the law interpretation. To them, all 508 bugs are critical.
Thanks Lucy for the tip about the bug; we'll definitely check that out.
Mike

On Tue, Mar 29, 2022 at 1:53 PM Léonie Watson <lwatson@tetralogical.com<mailto:lwatson@tetralogical.com>> wrote:
It appears to be a Jaws specific bug, confirmed using this test case
from Scott O'Hara:
https://scottaohara.github.io/testing/html-dialog/tos-dialog.html<https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Furldefense.com%2Fv3%2F__https%3A%2F%2Fscottaohara.github.io%2Ftesting%2Fhtml-dialog%2Ftos-dialog.html__%3B!!DZ3fjg!rWOZHt70ihpErQVuqPqTpgtCW71uEXOVMpO91W1lFegIeH5TRPktHMYIAEJAX6M%24&data=04%7C01%7Cjku%40uic.edu%7C1ff3af443dfa484cef4308da11d63e9e%7Ce202cd477a564baa99e3e3b71a7c77dd%7C0%7C0%7C637841909142621796%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=UdwXb88aEMBFjLM03HsRKkhud9BAUsI3%2FE%2B1C%2BhcAbQ%3D&reserved=0>

As a rule I advise against trying to fix bugs in individual assistive
tech, especially (as with this case) when the result is non-critical. It
almost always makes the code more complex and consequently more brittle.

I do think your assertion that screen reader users are unlikely to use
this functionality in dialogs might be true though. Certainly, it's not
a thing I ever recall trying to do - though I'm only a sample of one of
course!

Léonie.

On 29/03/2022 17:18, Mike Cleary wrote:
> Hello,
> We are frequently getting bug reports when using JAWS lists of headings
> or links to access the contents of open modal windows. In particular,
> when selecting a header on a modal, navigation on the modal tends to
> skip over a few elements.
>
> I think it unlikely that someone will open a JAWS list after opening a
> modal window, but our test team won't budge (and maybe I misjudge JAWS
> users), so we're looking for a fix.
>
> Any advice about how we can address this issue? or comment about the
> interaction of JAWS lists and modals in general?
>
> Mike
>
> --
> Mike Cleary | Scrum Master
> mike.cleary@grantsolutions.gov<mailto:mike.cleary@grantsolutions.gov> <mailto:mike.cleary@grantsolutions.gov<mailto:mike.cleary@grantsolutions.gov>>
>
> GrantSolutions| 1700 Rockville Pike | Suite 600 | Rockville, MD 20852
> Office: 703-288-5300 ext.157

--
Director @TetraLogical
https://tetralogical.com<https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Furldefense.com%2Fv3%2F__https%3A%2F%2Ftetralogical.com__%3B!!DZ3fjg!rWOZHt70ihpErQVuqPqTpgtCW71uEXOVMpO91W1lFegIeH5TRPktHMYIw74Rswg%24&data=04%7C01%7Cjku%40uic.edu%7C1ff3af443dfa484cef4308da11d63e9e%7Ce202cd477a564baa99e3e3b71a7c77dd%7C0%7C0%7C637841909142621796%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=fzm%2Bzn5Q50%2BmOts2bpGC39AA0wvGPlDG3s0%2BihC8fxc%3D&reserved=0>