RE: captions accessibility with screen readers.

Thanks everyone.

From memory, the different SC's for 1.2 do not clearly indicate this for Media controls. If this is correct, then silver needs to address the issue. In summary:

1. If you are hard of hearing or DEAF only, then caption being revealed is a must and control is provided to the end-user.
2. if you are a screen reader user: providing control to the user is the best practice. But not defined in the standards. Braille support I need to check for Live regions. As I was not aware of this.
3. if you are a Blind and DEAF person. Then Transcription in my view  still should be a must. As it benefits everyone, just not the Blind and DEAF. Providing accessible caption is a must.
4. Providing sub-titles which are accessible due to the video is in a different language than your native language. This should be a must and is different than captions. I am aware different countries use these two terms differently. Thus this point does bring up an interest issue if the person is DEAF and watching a movie in a different language than their native language. Should they see both the caption and sub-titles in their native language? Wouldn't their be duplication here of content? Again, providing control to the end-user to turn on either sub-titles or/and captions. The other points still stand.

Thus, providing the ultimate control to the end-user is best practise which supports my thoughts.

Note, As I am a screen reader user myself. Thus I do agree with the screen reader not being over ridden by aria-live. Providing control to the end-user supports everyone's  needs. On Netflix for Apple iOS. If you have voice-over on. I have found it reading out the Audio Describe information. AS already stated here. This is really annoying to a screen reader user. In fact it takes away the experience of the movie. I am not sure if the Netflix program or Voice-over is the fault here. 



Sean Murphy
SR ENGINEER.SOFTWARE ENGINEERING
seanmmur@cisco.com
Tel: +61 2 8446 7751

Cisco Systems, Inc.
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-----Original Message-----
From: Pyatt, Elizabeth J <ejp10@psu.edu> 
Sent: Tuesday, 18 December 2018 2:19 AM
To: bim.egan1@gmail.com
Cc: w3c-wai-ig <w3c-wai-ig@w3.org>
Subject: Re: captions accessibility with screen readers.

Hello:

I agree with Bim that forcing captions to be read out can be detrimental for someone using a screen reader. This can cause someone to hear two voices saying the same piece of dialogue on top of each other, and not necessarily in synch.  I experienced this in a testing session and it was very difficult for anyone with hearing to process.

Also, per Bim’s note - it’s important for developers to distinguish captions, which is a replacement for audio content, from audio description, which is a replacement for visual content. These pieces are information are usually very different and need separate delivery methods so users can select what they need.

It is possible that someone who is both severely deaf and has no usable vision might not get any use out of a video, but might prefer a text transcript with both pieces of information included (similar to a movie script which has both extensive visual descriptions in addition to the dialogue).

Elizabeth


> On Dec 17, 2018, at 8:11 AM, Bim Egan <bim.egan1@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> I strongly disagree. trying to use any alert to force captions to be announced through screenreaders is likely to do more harm than good. Captions are for people with hearing disabilities. If screenreaders can't avoid announcing them, their users would be subjected to the synthetic voice speaking over the audio track. 
>  
> I can see a use case for where text is only visually displayed or an informative image is used without narration, but the caption isn't the right mechanism for this, a more appropriate solution would be an audio description.
>  
> As it is, some screenreader browser combinations or particular implementations of video players do set the screenreader announcing captions or alternatively giving a running update of the current position, both of which are extremely distracting and make the video less, not more informative and enjoyable.
>  
> Bim
>  
> -------------
> Bim Egan
> Partner: AccessEquals
> W: www.accessequals.com
> E: bim.egan@accessequals.com
>  
> 
> From: Nigel Megitt [mailto:nigel.megitt@bbc.co.uk] 
> Sent: 17 December 2018 11:30
> To: Sean Murphy (seanmmur)
> Cc: W3C WAI ig
> Subject: Re: captions accessibility with screen readers.
> 
> Yes they should, in my opinion, role=“alert” aria-live="assertive”.  If you’re watching video with captions, you’re probably not interacting with the rest of the page so much. However I can see that there may be a case here for changing this depending on whether the video is full screen or not. Certainly in the case of a page with a whole bunch of captioned videos, if more than one is playing simultaneously, this would be a usability nightmare (think social media pages with lots of videos embedded), so something more subdued is needed. I don’t think I’ve seen a UX pattern for this that really works yet, but I’d like to learn more about how this might be possible.
> 
>> On 17 Dec 2018, at 04:49, Sean Murphy (seanmmur) <seanmmur@cisco.com> wrote:
>> 
>> Thoughts from the wider community.
>> I am wanting to bounce something off the community in relation to accessible media controls. Should the captions be accessible to a screen reader? When the caption is, the useability of the web page and general usage suffers due to much information. 
>> So should the captions be accessible by a screen reader? If so, what ARIA property should be used? As ARIA-live=”polite” is to verbose.
>> <image001.png>
>> Sean Murphy
>> SR ENGINEER.SOFTWARE ENGINEERING
>> seanmmur@cisco.com
>> Tel: +61 2 8446 7751
>> Cisco Systems, Inc.
>> The Forum 201 Pacific Highway
>> ST LEONARDS
>> 2065
>> Australia
>> cisco.com
>> <image002.gif>
>> Think before you print.
>> This email may contain confidential and privileged material for the sole use of the intended recipient. Any review, use, distribution or disclosure by others is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient (or authorized to receive for the recipient), please contact the sender by reply email and delete all copies of this message.
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Received on Monday, 17 December 2018 22:58:01 UTC