- From: Ian Sharpe <isforums@manx.net>
- Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2012 23:03:02 +0100
- To: <duboisp2@gmail.com>, "'Benjamin Hawkes-Lewis'" <bhawkeslewis@googlemail.com>
- Cc: "'WAI Interest Group'" <w3c-wai-ig@w3.org>
By sheer coincidence I've just come across the article below which would seem to demonstrate the point I was making. It is the beginnings of a canvas control library, and I'm sure there are others if I looked. I haven't looked at the article in detail or tried the code yet but based on what I did read I would make the following points: 1. At a glance, I suspect the kind of styling available via this particular library is probably achieveable using CSS3, such as gradient backgrounds. 2. If there is such demand for more fine-grained control over the appearance of standard elements, not currently available through CSS, surely it would be more sensible to extend what is possible through CSS to achieve this? I can already hear some saying that CSS would become even more bloated and there will always be something that somebody wants to be able to do that would be too complex to implement. But what is worse, encouraging people to abuse elements to address a perceived shortfall in existing standards and then having to spend significant time and resources trying to work out how to deal with the fallout from an accessibility perspective? Or extending CSS to provide more control and flexibility in appearance using a well understood and accessible presentation model? I suspect that in most cases, CSS would be sufficient to address most people's requirements and if it isn't, it could (should) be extended to do so. I do accept the points others have made regarding valid use case scenarios but I really feel this kind of approach should be more actively discouraged. How this might be achieved though is obviously open to debate. Or to think about it in a different way, if you take this approach to the extreme, there's no reason why the entire web couldn't end up using the canvas as the primary user interface. Kind of a world away from the semantic web. Anyway, here's the article: http://www.codeproject.com/Articles/410856/Canvas-Control-Library Cheers Ian -----Original Message----- From: Pierre Dubois [mailto:duboisp2@gmail.com] Sent: 06 August 2012 19:18 To: Benjamin Hawkes-Lewis Cc: WAI Interest Group Subject: Re: Canvas and ARIA alternatives Thanks Benjamin, Now I better understand the purpose of the aria-describedby attribute. I updated the charts widget as per your recommendation and now the aria-describedby is only used if the table has a description in his caption element. > The table should is available in a visible form, e.g. for users who > have difficulty understanding the chart and for users who want to > extract the data. (Could also leave it fully visible or hide it > off-page behind a link.) FYI - It is possible for the Web Editor that would use this widget to do not get the table encapsulated in a details/summary. They would just need to add the css class 'wb-charts-noencapsulation-true' in the table class attribute. Cheers, :-) Pierre Dubois 819-773-2881 ~ Envoyez de mon telephone -----Original Message----- From: Benjamin Hawkes-Lewis <bhawkeslewis@googlemail.com> Date: Sun, 5 Aug 2012 11:01:47 To: Pierre Dubois<duboisp2@gmail.com> Cc: Ian Sharpe<isforums@manx.net>; <rcorominas@technosite.es>; WAI Interest Group<w3c-wai-ig@w3.org> Subject: Re: Canvas and ARIA alternatives On Sat, Aug 4, 2012 at 5:47 AM, Pierre Dubois <duboisp2@gmail.com> wrote: > Once the graphic are generated, I decided to auto set the attribute > aria-describedby on the figure element to provide a better accessibility. > The aria-describedby attribute have a reference to the HTML table. > Do you think that is a sufficient technique to set the accessibility > for the Canva / SVG element in my case ? Yeah, I think ARIA has generated a lot of confusion over usage of aria-describedby. UAs are required to reduce the referent of aria-describedby (your table) to a plain text string for exposure as an "accessible description" for the canvas. http://www.w3.org/WAI.new/PF/aria/roles#namecalculation That some UAs might additionally expose a mechanism for navigating to the accessible description doesn't mean you can safely refer to content that cannot be easily consumed when its structure and semantics are stripped away to plain text. Basically aria-describedby is only suitable for short descriptions. Unfortunately ARIA provides no mechanism for separating out what contributes to the accessible description and the navigational link. There's been a bit of discussion around adding an @aria-describedat attribute, reusing @longdesc, or minting a new HTML attribute for this purpose. So I don't think your technique is ideal. For now, I think you're better off just making reference to the long text alternative via the short text alternative, like so: <figure> <figcaption> <strong>2011 Sales</strong> <p id="desc">Sales grew from $595,304 per month to $847,390.</p> </figcaption> <svg role="img" aria-label="2011 Sales Chart. Details in table following." aria-describedby="desc"></svg> <details> <summary>2011 Sales Table</summary> <details> <table aria-label="2011 Sales Table" aria-describedby="desc">...</table> </details> </figure> A short visible summary is included of what the chart actually tells us - more digestible than either chart or table, potentially. It is explicitly designated as the short accessible description for both canvas and table. <strong> is used to distinguish the reference title of the figure from the rest of the caption. The short text alternative for the <svg> element makes reference to the long text alternative that follows, for the aid of users with visual impairments jumping between images on the page; compare this technique: http://www.w3.org/TR/WCAG20-TECHS/G74.html In theory <svg> has its own accessibility semantics (e.g. the <description> element), but as these are poorly supported I've overridden them at the ARIA level using role="img", with aria-label and aria-describedby to provide text alternatives. The table should is available in a visible form, e.g. for users who have difficulty understanding the chart and for users who want to extract the data. (Could also leave it fully visible or hide it off-page behind a link.) -- Benjamin Hawkes-Lewis
Received on Tuesday, 7 August 2012 22:03:33 UTC