Re: [w3c-wai-ig] <none>

Ramón wrote:

> Ok, Let's say that you are a keyboard-only, sighted user. You get to a form to edit contact information, with fields for "fixed phone", "mobile phone" and "fax". Since you are editing existing data, the placeholder text is not there, so there is no visual label.

Agreed -- But do we know if what Bart proposes allows for edits to be made? Instructional text could well provide sufficient info on the control--Shouldn't that help keyboard only users. Also, must someone remain within the bounds of success criterion 3.2.2 to comply? 

> Do you think this is an edge case scenario...? I've just experienced it in my iPhone, trying to figure out  which field was the name and which the surname...

I don't think it is an edge case. It's simple: Apple chose to ignore it, and what you just experienced proves that a sponsor can and will override SC 3.2.2 or whatever accessibility requirements are out there to suit their needs. 

All I am saying is that not having labels is ok in certain situations, but then you MUST ensure that users, including keyboard only users, get the necessary information to complete the task.

thanks,
Devarshi

On Dec 12, 2011, at 6:34 PM, Ramón Corominas <listas@ramoncorominas.com> wrote:

> Ok, Let's say that you are a keyboard-only, sighted user. You get to a form to edit contact information, with fields for "fixed phone", "mobile phone" and "fax". Since you are editing existing data, the placeholder text is not there, so there is no visual label.
> 
> The only way to see each label is to delete the existing text, which is not very intuitive nor acceptable in my opinion.
> 
> I think that visual labels are as needed as screenreader-aware labels.
> 
> Do you think this is an edge case scenario...? I've just experienced it in my iPhone, trying to figure out  which field was the name and which the surname...
> 
> Cheers,
> Ramón.
> 
> 
> Devarshi Said:
> 
>> Jason wrote:
>> In my opinion, the best use of the placeholder attribute among the
>> popular browsers (IE and FF) is to use it for supplemental information
>> (i.e. constraint information) and used in conjunction with explicit
>> label markup and the title attribute.
>> 
>> *** I would like to understand it from a different perspective--What
>> if the sponsor does not want visible and off-screen labels. Upping the
>> ante, what then he expects end users to get the most compatible
>> version of the browser.
>> In essence, when without using explicit labels:
>> 1. There is sufficient contrast,
>> 2. There is an informative title attribute, and,
>> 3. For those who need instructions, instructions exist about the new behavior.
>> Would that be a failure? Again, the question from Bart says: Do you
>> consider this sufficient to comply with success criterion 3.3.2 labels
>> or instructions? ***
>> 
>> Thanks,
>> Devarshi
>> 
>