- From: Maciej Stachowiak <mjs@apple.com>
- Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2009 10:47:25 -0700
- To: joshue.oconnor@ncbi.ie
- Cc: Charles McCathieNevile <chaals@opera.com>, "John Foliot - WATS.ca" <foliot@wats.ca>, Wai-Ig <w3c-wai-ig@w3.org>, wai-xtech@w3.org, 'HTMLWG' <public-html@w3.org>, WebAIM Discussion List <webaim-forum@list.webaim.org>, Gawds_Discuss <gawds_discuss@yahoogroups.com>
On Mar 22, 2009, at 3:13 AM, Joshue O Connor wrote: > Maciej Stachowiak wrote: >> >> On Mar 19, 2009, at 8:34 AM, Charles McCathieNevile wrote: >> >>> >>>> I propose that >>>> any instance of <canvas> that lacks at a minimum the 2 proposed >>>> mandatory >>>> values be non-conformant and not render on screen. The inclusion >>>> of this >>>> information should not be left to chance - the specification >>>> requires >>>> that some fallback content exist - and if it does not exist then >>>> the >>>> <canvas> element is incomplete, thus it should simply fail all >>>> users... >>> >>> I think that this is a non-starter. As explained in a narrower >>> follow-up, the penalty to browsers who do this means that mainstream >>> browsers simply won't, in all probability. >> >> I agree with Chaals on this. We would likely not be willing to stop >> rendering existing <canvas> content in Safari. > > Yes, all the more reason to ensure that the API is suitable /before/ > it > leaves the stable so we are not facing a situation where we need to > retrofit the API for accessibility. The <canvas> horse has long since left the barn. We are not up for breaking existing deployed <canvas> content at this point. I will note that we did break all existing <canvas> content once, to convert <canvas> from a void element to an element that can have children, in order to support fallback content for accessibility and graceful degradation. This change was made when <canvas> became part of HTML5. At the time, <canvas> was only really used in WebKit- specific Dashboard widget content, and it was clear this change was necessary to make <canvas> work on the public Web. All the same, it was quite painful, and we had to go to some lengths to get all content converted and to add compatibility hacks Now that <canvas> has significant deployment in content on the public Web, I think it is too late to make any compatibility-breaking changes that make existing content not render. To do so would be in direct contradiction of the Support Existing Content design principle. I could imagine trumping that principle if a truly compatibility- breaking change was needed to even enable accessibility, but that doesn't seem to be the case here. As to the proposal itself: <canvas> already has one way of providing an accessible alternative, namely the nested fallback content. The proposal adds three additional ways, makes one of the mandatory, and makes noting the author mandatory. This seems unhelpful to me. Content rendered to canvas does not need four different representations to assistive technology, it needs one good one. In addition, the author attribute and its additional status do not seem well thought out to me. A <canvas> element does not meaningfully have an author; it is the JavaScript code that draws into the canvas which may have one or more authors. That being said, I do think the accessibility story is weak for complex content rendered using canvas. Traditionally, native development platforms provide some degree of automatic high-level accessibility support for built-in controls, and then a low-level accessibility API for custom controls that developers build using drawing primitives and events directly. The Web platform needs something similar. For images that are generated on the fly, but thereafter not modified, a textual alternative may suffice. For animated graphics demos, a description of the demo could be enough. But for truly interactive application-like content that is custom- rendered, a true accessibility API is needed, not just an assortment of different textual alternatives. Henri has argued in the past that the way to provide this for <canvas> is to apply ARIA markup to the fallback content. I am not 100% sure this is sufficient for a complex tool like a text editor, but it seems to me that Bespin could be a test case for this kind of approach (assuming browsers expose the accessibility tree under <canvas>). Regards, Maciej
Received on Sunday, 22 March 2009 17:48:10 UTC