RE: Method for minting new Success Criteria

Hi david:

I don’t believe SC(s) should be based on if AT can do something, but rather if the information is provided which enables the AT to do its part.  So I would probably have to strongly disagree with this.  I don’t discount the whole “accessibility supported” concept, however, whether a developer or product owner passes or fails can’t be driven by changing assistive technologies—heck JAWS includes OCR to read things which are completely inaccessible but that doesn’t mean such items should pass as they certainly aren’t providing the information in a programmatically determinable way.  There can be some serious magic that makes AT work, but the whole idea is that ingeneral there shouldn’t have to be magic to make things work.




Allen Hoffman
Deputy Executive Director
The Office of Accessible Systems & Technology
Department of Homeland Security
202-447-0503 (voice)
allen.hoffman@hq.dhs.gov<mailto:allen.hoffman@hq.dhs.gov>

DHS Accessibility Helpdesk
202-447-0440 (voice)
202-447-0582 (fax)
202-447-5857 (TTY)
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From: David MacDonald [mailto:david100@sympatico.ca]
Sent: Monday, November 02, 2015 9:53 PM
To: Hoffman, Allen
Cc: Wayne Dick; Joshue O Connor; WCAG
Subject: Re: Method for minting new Success Criteria

Hi Allen

 I think the Success Criteria describe a state of being... over time the conditions which cause that state of being can shift to a certain degree. For instance, as AT gets smarter, we found it not necessary to fail layout tables, just recently we made a major change that allowed the title attribute or aria label to be an alternative for an image instead of alt text.
To me mapping to existing success criteria should be our first line of investigation and only after a thorough exploration of that should we consider new Success Criteria inside an extension.
We want to make the existing WCAG as robust and modern as possible and leverage it's place in legislation etc...


Cheers,

David MacDonald



CanAdapt Solutions Inc.

Tel:  613.235.4902

LinkedIn<http://www.linkedin.com/in/davidmacdonald100>

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On Mon, Nov 2, 2015 at 7:47 AM, Hoffman, Allen <allen.hoffman@hq.dhs.gov<mailto:allen.hoffman@hq.dhs.gov>> wrote:
Mapping them to existing SC(s) as sufficient techniques or failures makes sense, but creating supplement SC(s) will not make them normative in legal frameworks which connect to the guidelines at a point in time only, not this and forward.


Allen Hoffman
Deputy Executive Director
The Office of Accessible Systems & Technology
Department of Homeland Security
202-447-0503<tel:202-447-0503> (voice)
allen.hoffman@hq.dhs.gov<mailto:allen.hoffman@hq.dhs.gov>

DHS Accessibility Helpdesk
202-447-0440<tel:202-447-0440> (voice)
202-447-0582<tel:202-447-0582> (fax)
202-447-5857<tel:202-447-5857> (TTY)
accessibility@dhs.gov<mailto:accessibility@dhs.gov>

This communication, along with any attachments, is covered by federal and state law governing electronic communications and may contain sensitive and legally privileged information. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution, use or copying of this message is strictly prohibited.  If you have received this message in error, please reply immediately to the sender and delete this message.  Thank you.

From: David MacDonald [mailto:david100@sympatico.ca<mailto:david100@sympatico.ca>]
Sent: Friday, October 30, 2015 7:38 PM
To: Wayne Dick
Cc: Joshue O Connor; WCAG
Subject: Re: Method for minting new Success Criteria

I think as much as possible we should try to map our findings into the existing WCAG which is required by law in many jurisdictions. It will be difficult to get jurisdictions to "update" their requirements, but addressing them in the existing WCAG will automatically pull them in. As long as we can map them to existing SCs


Cheers,

David MacDonald



CanAdapt Solutions Inc.

Tel:  613.235.4902<tel:613.235.4902>

LinkedIn<http://www.linkedin.com/in/davidmacdonald100>

www.Can-Adapt.com<http://www.Can-Adapt.com>



  Adapting the web to all users
            Including those with disabilities

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On Fri, Oct 30, 2015 at 4:49 PM, Wayne Dick <wayneedick@gmail.com<mailto:wayneedick@gmail.com>> wrote:
Hi,
I think the answer to this question is yes.  We are talking about needs that were missed in the first iteration 2.0.  We want the new criteria to carry the same legitimacy of the original criteria. The WCAG 2.0 process was very credible and objectively good. In all human processes there are oversights, but serious critics don't fault WCAG WG on their process or even the outcomes. We just need to fill in missing criteria with the same care used in the original process.
Wayne

On Thu, Oct 29, 2015 at 9:02 AM, Joshue O Connor <josh@interaccess.ie<mailto:josh@interaccess.ie>> wrote:
Hi all,

The question has come up 'Do we need to follow the same form as WCAG with our extensions success criteria'? A possible method would be to map suggested COGA (and other groups) current new SCs (as techniques) to existing WCAG success criteria. And if we find that some don’t easily map to an existing SC, then that could represent a gap – and therefore the need for a new SC.

Therefore one path which could help us to troubleshoot this whole thing would be to see all current or proposed SCs – as techniques, then work backwards from there.

Another way, is to try to flip any suggested SC into a testable statement. If that can't be done, then its likely a technique that can fit an existing SC.

Comments, brickbats welcome.

Josh