Re: [html-techs-tf] caption vs alt

Ramón,
>>Indeed, I see a risk here. Imagine that we include a single figure for a group of >>images that belong to the same event: ...
Not clear if you are agreeing with me or countering  what I said.
As per my understanding, the proposal is for Using figcaption to label
an image and doing away with the alt only when a figure has a single
image and a figcaption ... not multiple images within the figure.
So when multiple pictures are uploaded at once, a figure can  at best
serve as a grouping element. Of course every image needs its
equivalent text.
But it will not be exposed as a list of images so list markup is better.

>>Maybe it is not critical, but there are some use cases. For example, you can write >>several articles with illustrations and use CSS to automatically number them in the <figcaption>:
Are you suggesting there is more content than an image and a
figcaption inside the figure?
Then I believe the proposed technique of using figcaption as a
replacement for alt will not apply.
Regards,
Sailesh


On 1/15/14, Ramón Corominas <rcorominas@technosite.es> wrote:
> Hello all,
>
> Sailesh wrote:
>
>  > As I see it, the figure element is a tool for supporting SC 1.3.1 and
>  > the figcaption's  primary purpose is to label the figure;  that it can
>  > be used to label an image within is secondary if not incidental.
>
> I definitely agree, the <figcaption> identifies the <figure>, not the
> image or any other content of the figure (for example, if the figure is
> a code example). Maybe the image can take the accName from the
> <figcaption> as a "fallback" in case there is no @alt, but this is also
> an assumption that the <figcaption> serves the same purpose as the image
> itself, which in my opinion would not be so common. In any case, the
> image must be exposed to the SR, so suppressing the @alt makes no
> difference in terms of what is read.
>
> The only advantage I can see would be the few bytes of the @alt in the
> HTML code, and maybe better consistency if both the @alt and the
> <figcaption> are created manually ans separately. I guess that in most
> cases they will be generated through a CMS.
>
>
>  > If there were a batch of pictures uploaded with no ability to add alt,
>  > I suppose they should all be in a single figure element (as a group)
>  > or they should be marked up with li in a single ul/ol.
>
> Indeed, I see a risk here. Imagine that we include a single figure for a
> group of images that belong to the same event:
>
> <figure>
>    <img src="csun14_01.jpg" />
>    <img src="csun14_02.jpg" />
>    <img src="csun14_03.jpg" />
>    <figcaption>CSUN 2014</figcaption>
> </figure>
>
> Would "CSUN 2014" be a valid text equivalente for every image? How can a
> screen reader user distinguish between them? Shouldn't be this case
> explicitly prohibited? Would we allow 2 of the images to have an alt ant
> the third one to rely on the <figcaption> (assumming that it would be a
> valid text equivalent)?
>
>> I do not see why it is critical to:
>> - group an image with a grouping element when the figure has no other
>> content than an img and a figcaption. What is being grouped together?
>
> Maybe it is not critical, but there are some use cases. For example, you
> can write several articles with illustrations and use CSS to
> automatically number them in the <figcaption>:
>
> main { counter-reset: figs; }
> figure { counter-increment: figs; }
> figcaption::before { content: "Figure " counter(figs) ". "; }
>
> Then, you can reorder or reuse the illustrations preserving an
> appropriate order.
>
>> - and to grant an exception for not using alt only in this situation.
>> It simply complicates matters for developers and testers.
>
> I agree.
>
>
>> Ramón: In my experience JAWS14/15 (with FF) announces both figure and
>> the div with role=group  as a group and not as a frame.
>
> I've just re-tested and you are right... In English. I originally tested
> in Spanish and JAWS reads it as "marco" (= frame), so I assummed that
> the translation would be that. This is also the case for any
> role="group" element, so I will file a bug to the Spanish translation of
> JAWS.
>
> Regards,
> Ramón.
>
>
>

Received on Wednesday, 15 January 2014 14:38:26 UTC