[[ I sent a copy of this to the html-math list earlier today, but have not received a copy in return. Be aware that you may receive duplicate copies, and can afford to trash at least one of them. Apologies for the clutter, if it occurs. -Ron ]] Ping writes: > It is a fairly fundamental difference in approach, yes. I think > that opinions vary about how difficult the semantic problem is > (i think it can be handled a piece at a time and by people in > the appropriate areas of expertise, but someone on www-html has > dismissed it as virtually impossible). > > ... > > I'm curious to know in more detail what you mean by your last > sentence. In your mind, what have you "ruled out" and "not ruled out" > among ideas from MINSE? Discussing pros and cons about semantical markup is a Difficult Thing. Those who think it's an intractable problem are in the awkward position of saying something "can't" be done, but lack a formal proof for the assertion and, as a result, are almost always unconvincing to those who intuitively feel that semantical markup is the proper way to go. It may be that the Can'ts approach the problem from Without while the Cans approach it from Within. This said, I'll take a little walk around the rim of the Abyss. I think long-windedness will not help at all. I do have the feeling, though, that, much as we'd like to finesse the issue, it does divide us to some degree as a group since we're all trying to accommodate semantical markup, but probably don't have common notions as to what we're trying to accomplish. Mathematics is a formal science. One can take various attitudes toward mathematical meaning, but a recurring theme is that the meanings of terms lie in their positions within formal theories. This is meant to imply that "meaning", whatever it is, attaches significance to a wide variety of instances and that meanings don't come alone, but rather within collections of other meanings. "+" might "mean" the addition operator of Peano arithmetic (considered as a first- or second-order formal system or a part of set theory or category theory). It might also "mean" the group operation in a class of commutative groups, a situation wherein we eschew talk of formal systems and rather speak of a class of Platonic models. Now Platonic models might only be considered real insofar as they're specified or instantiated within some more fundamental foundation (such as set theory), and formal foundational systems might only be considered as abstract means of discussing collections of models. With the advent of computer algebra systems, we can also arrive at a semantics which says "+ means whatever Mathematica `thinks' it means". My point here is that we have a number of ways of closely (or not-so-closely) specifying notions of semantics, but I suspect we all adopt a rough and ready attitude of putting close specification off until we really have to use such a thing. The reason for putting off the problem is that we (mathematicians and people who employ mathematical discourse) work in a naturally efficient way: discursive traffic proceeds quite well without specifying semantics. You'll enjoy reading the book. What do you mean "read"? How do you regard this as a "book"? So my own attitude toward semantical specification is that: a. Yes, it can be done to a variety of depths for individual situations; b. The wider the situations become, the more difficult the teasing is; and c. The more detail we require in our semantics, the harder it is to understand the analysis and the more vocabulary we have to learn. These attitudes toward semantics hold for all areas of knowledge, not just mathematics. So what does one expect in attaching semantics to HTML-Math? We clearly must deal with what the OpenMath folks have called "contexts". I don't claim to know what the word means in detail, but I believe the idea includes both "areas of discourse" (such as Algebraic Geometry and Real Analysis) and "formal theories" (elliptic curves over C, ...). The collection of "contexts" covers the subject of mathematics as neighborhoods on a manifold in that contexts sometimes contain one another, sometimes overlap, sometimes are disjoint. We expect that there are a great many of these, and that to be manageable, software will have to help in telling us what's available, how we've named them, what their relations are. Contexts are also not enough in themselves since we work with "objects" within these contexts and "understanding" (be it by a human reader or by software) must discern the meanings or designations of the objects. Objects may be at the level of the "+" in a commutative group or "an analytic function from C to C" or a "map from X to M representing an nth cohomology class of X with coefficients in M". Generally, one might expect that the collection of semantical indicators of a given math notation snippet will contain both identifiers of "classically understood" mathematical objects and identifiers of "ad hoc" or "bound" objects ("bound" by a quantifier such as "all" or "some"; one might employ an argument about all continuous functions, f, and then use the f as an indicator of any such function) peculiar to the snippet. In widening our area of interest from a snippet to a paper to a book, the number of "ad hoc" semantical specifications also increases, the degree depending upon the specific language of the paper or book. Research mathematics tends to include many ad hoc objects, as well as objects which might become classically understood (i.e. part of some formal theory) at some point, but are not now. A K-12 text probably contains only classically understood operators and some relatively simple type specifications (e.g. "n is a natural number", "p is a polynomial over Q" (which may well turn out to really be "p is a polynomial over any field")). It is clear, I think, that the job of doing semantics in full (to the point of naming each object's context and attaching a type-theoretic specification) is large for a 20 page paper published in one of the AMS research journals. The job is more manageable for a standard text on first-year calculus. The job of generating specifications and software to handle semantics over all types of mathematical discourse is also large. The questions for our group members may be: 1. How can we bite off something we can handle? 2. How can we leave some of this to OpenMath so that we can attend to other details? 3. How can we accommodate both lower-end texts which may use rather straightforward semantics and high-end research information whose semantics is unsettled and much more complicated? My own feeling is that we will do best by making our semantical bindings as late as possible, when semantics is needed and when the target is clear (why worry about whether p is a polynomial over Q or some other field until we have to?). Semantics disambiguates (by definition), but at the cost of enlarging the notational base and therefore disturbing the efficiency of abstract discussion. This view must be moderated by recognizing that there are other situations (such as producing a calculus text with Scientific Word and Maple) where it is quite valuable to have semantics attached. And more generally, while the view expressed in the previous paragraph may be appropriate for free-form discussion on objects which lie at the frontiers of realms whose calculable aspects have not yet been implemented, it misses the case where discourse is still original, albeit within mathematical regions whose structure is conventionalized and where software tools exist. I do urge that, as each of us discusses need for semantics, we keep in mind the various uses and difficulties for different types of mathematical discourse, and that we comment on these targets as appropriate. -RonReceived on Tuesday, 20 August 1996 14:11:13 UTC
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