W3C home > Mailing lists > Public > w3c-dist-auth@w3.org > July to September 1999

RE: Bindings, Locks, and MOVE

From: <ccjason@us.ibm.com>
Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 19:26:51 -0400
To: w3c-dist-auth@w3.org
Message-ID: <852567EC.00802B81.00@D51MTA07.pok.ibm.com>

  2)  I am fine with the lock-token being MOVED with a resource.  If we can
  get away with saying cross-server MOVE is not supported, then the individual
  servers simply need to make a way of keeping locks on their own server.  I
  believe this is how we should proceed.  It sounds like we are cutting out a
  bunch of functionality, but I think it will take a whole set of working
  groups to get cross-server MOVE to work correctly in all cases anyway, so we
  might as well punt now.

Just to be clear.  It is the *implementations* that can chose not to support
x-server MOVE's.  In the spec this would presumably be a "CAN".  I just want to
distinguish between implementations and the spec.  -- So... it would be the
server writers that would be (understandably) "cutting out a bunch of
functionality"... not the spec writers.

Also to clarify, I think we (as spec writers) are free to specify x-server
behavior in WebDAV and to keep x-server issues in mind as we design WebDAV...
but I think the philosophy is that we won't try to define the protocol that the
two servers use to cooperate.  I think this final thing is our only agreed
restriction.  As far as how far we go on the former... I think that's up to us
to decide.   A case in point might be... for servers to move locks across
servers, they almost certainly would have to do proxy authentication.  That is,
both servers would need to agree on the authenticity credentials for a given
principal (AKA client).   We could enhance webdav operations that are
potentially cross server to specify the credentials to use when interacting with
the second server.  Whether we chose to do that in WebDAV right now is up to us.

  3)  I believe (with I think most other people), that the language
  surrounding the use of write-lock, should remain a MUST.

I take it you are refering to "protection of the URI".  That's where
the MUST vs. SHOULD debate was.

  <kw/>I now assume that locks are locking the resource not the URI.

Yes... with one exception: the issue of URI protection.
Right now... protection
is based on a hybrid of URI and resource.  It's essentially a mapping
that is protected... but that can be (in Judith's proposal) caused
to migrate if we hold the appropriate locks.  We haven't actually
clearly delineated when it moves and when it does not.

  A resource is being MOVEd.  The locks are on that resource and / or its
  destination, not the collections that contain them.

Yes if I understand you.  It is kind of an anti-null-lock view.
That's why I thought it was
odd that GC is starting to waver in his resistance to null locks, when
he was strong in his resistance to them in the former proposal
where null-locks actually filled a larger void and worked a bit

  1. The source resource is locked, but the destination is not.
  MOVE /a/b to /x/y, where /a/b is locked  but /a/ is not and /x/y is not.

  <KW> /a/b moves to /x/y and remains locked with the same lock-token it had
  before.  The only Lock Token mentioned still exists and remains on the
  resource it was locking.</KW>

And since you liked it when we mentioned lock tokens last time, I'll mention
here again...
The lock token must be provided to pass the protected URI test.  (I assume that
/a/b mapping is protected... rather than some unmentioned mapping.)

  2. The source resource is not locked, but the destination is.
  MOVE /a/b to /x/y, where /a/b is not locked and /x/ is not locked, but /x/y
  is locked

  <KW> This one gets a little weird.  I assume that we can delete /x/y since
  we have the lock on it.  This delete removes the lock from the system.  When
  /a/b is moved to /x/y, it still is not locked.

  As a user, I might expect that /a/b (which is now /x/y) has the /x/y lock,
  but I have always thought (from a user's perspective) that a merge would
  happen and not a delete followed by a write.  But the fact that the lock is
  removed from the system, does make the rest of the scenarios work

Sounds reasonable. Except for one caveat.  What if the resource that was
at the destination also has other bindings to it.  Does the
lock go away... or does it drift to the other URI on that resource?  Is
this dependent on which URI was used when it was locked?  We need to
discuss this.  -- BTW, there's also the academic case of the lock
not being *rooted* at the destination... but inherited through another
binding.  I think we all agree what happens then, so it's academic.

Lock token must be provided to destroy a lock.  And probably to cause the
lock to drift.

  3. Both are locked, but with separate locks.
  MOVE /a/b to /x/y, where /a/b has lock L1 and /x/y has lock L2, but neither
  /a/ nor /x/ is locked.

  <KW> This will remove L2 from the system, and the new /x/y is still locked
  by L1.</KW>

<jlc>Sounds good.  Both tokens provided.  if URI's are protected.</jlc>

  A resource is being MOVEd.  The locks are Depth: infinity locks on the
  collections that contain either the source or the destination location.

  4. The source collection is locked, but the destination collection is not
  MOVE /a/b to /x/y, where /a/ is locked, but /x/ is not and /x/y is not.

  <KW> Since the lock on /a/b comes from /a, the lock is not kept on its move.
  /a remains locked, but the new resource /x/y loses the lock it had on it.

<jlc>lock token needed for the *write* lock because the
state of the locked collection is changing.

I just wanted to note that only one URI is "protected", but because
the parent collection of all the other resources in the tree are also
*write locked*, all of the URI's in that tree here are essentially
"protected" despite only one being officially protected.  This is
specific to write locks I believe.  If anyone doesn't think so, we
should discuss it.

  5. The source collection is not locked, but the destination collection is.
  MOVE /a/b to /x/y, where /a/ is not locked and /a/b is not locked, but /x/
  is locked.

  <KW> The original /x/y is removed, and the lock on that resource is removed.
  /a/b is then moved there, and picks up the lock from its new parent /x/</KW>

<jlc>Lock must be provided because the destination collection is write
locked and is changing state.

  6. Both are locked, but with separate locks.
  MOVE /a/b to /x/y, where /a/ has lock L1 and /b/ has lock L2.

  <KW> /x/y is removed and its resource is no longer locked by L2.  /a/b is
  removed from /a's lock, and the resource is added to the L2 lock space.</KW>

<jlc/>both tokens provided as per above.

  One lock is at the collection level, the other at the resource level.

  7. The source resource is locked, and the destination collection is locked
  with a different token
  MOVE /a/b to /x/y, where /a/b has lock L1, /a/ is not locked, and /x/ has
  lock L2.

  <KW> I believe this must FAIL.  A user cannot have 2 locks on the same
  resource, and therefore needs to remove one of them before the MOVE can

Can't have two *exclusive* locks of the same type on the same resource.
Otherwise I agree.

Both tokens needed.  Source, if protected URI; Dest, because changing

  8. The source collection is locked, the destination resource (not its
  collection) is locked with a different token
  MOVE /a/b to /x/y, where /a/ has lock L1, /x/ is not locked, and /x/y has
  lock L2.

  <KW> Strangely enough (to the user), this succeeds.  The lock L2 is removed
  from the system during the DELETE phase of the move, /a/b is then moved.  It
  is removed from /a's L1 and no lock now exists on the new /x/y </KW>

<jlc> Which part of this do you think is surprising to the user?

Both tokens provided.  Source, because state changes; dest, because
presumed protected URI.  Once again we can talk about drifting locks

  For the following cases, should the MOVE succeed or fail? If it succeeds,
  what should the lock state be afterwards?

  9. The source resource was locked through one mapping, and a MOVE is
  attempted through a different mapping.
  9a. /a/b and /c/d map to R. /a/ is locked. MOVE /c/d to /x/y.

  <KW> Since locks are on resources, if the correct lock-token is passed, I
  say this succeeds.  The new /x/y is still locked via /a's lock because the
  binding for /a/b still exists.  In order to do something to the new /x/y you
  need to pass the correct lock-token.</KW>

<jlc> If the lock is not a depth lock, then I don't think a lock token is
needed because the state of /a/ is not at risk.

BTW, I think when we said locks are on resources, what we really meant was
that locks are *rooted* on resources.  Of course we're free to evaluate
any proposal.

So... if it's a depth lock...  I'd say that a lock token still isn't
needed to carry out the MOVE.  The state of no locked resource isn't at
risk of changing.  And I don't think the only URI that is protected
is /a/, so that isn't an issue either.

  9b. /a/b and /c/d map to R. /a/ is not locked, but /a/b is. MOVE /c/d to

  <KW> Again the MOVE succeeds if the token for R is given, the resource is
  still locked and bound to /a/b and the new /x/y </KW>

<jlc>I think we disagree about providing a lock token.  The state of R
is not changed here, so the *write* lock on R isn't relevent.  The
protection on /a/b isn't relevent because the mapping from /a/b to R isn't
at risk.  I suggest that no token is needed.

  10. The destination resource was locked through one mapping, and a MOVE is
  attempted through a different mapping.
  10a. /w/x and /y/z map to R. /w/ is locked. MOVE /a/b to /y/z.

  <KW> If correct lock token for R is given (If header with a tagged list of
  /y/z and the correct token) the move completes.  Since /w is locking the
  resource R, it continues to do so, but /y/z no longer maps to R so it is not
  locked anymore </KW>

Once again, I don't think a lock token is needed.  Depth lock or singleton.
The only resources whose state changes are /a/ and /y/.  Neither is locked.
The only protected URI/mapping is /w/.  It's not at risk.

  10b. /w/x and /y/z map to R. /w/ is not locked, but /w/x is. MOVE /a/b to

  <KW> If the correct lock-token for R is passed (through the correct IF
  header and tagged list), the MOVE succeeds.  When it is done, /w/x is still
  locking R, and the new /y/z is no longer locked as it now points to a new
  resource R2. </KW>

<jlc>We probably need to work out exactly what is protected.  A previous
note by my indicates that it's a single URI to resource mapping that is
protected.  Even in today's advanced collection meeting, folks spoke of
a chain of bindings being protected... rather than a mapping.  (This is
admittedly usually equivalent.)

I say here that no token is necessary.  The only resources changing states
are /a/ and /y/.  Neither is locked.  The only URI protected is /w/x
and it's mapping remains unchanged after the move.  So no lock tokens
are needed to pull this off.

BTW, I should add... Disclaimer:  What I'm suggesting in all my comments
above is what I think we're proposing. It doesn't mean I've actually
thought about whether what I've suggested above provides what a client
would want in all of these situations.   I'm only commenting on what
behavior we'd expect based on our object model.

Oh... Good note Kevin.
Received on Tuesday, 14 September 1999 19:20:15 UTC

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