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Re: New W3C Web Site Launched

From: Benjamin Nowack <bnowack@semsol.com>
Date: Thu, 15 Oct 2009 13:29:37 +0200
To: Ian Jacobs <ij@w3.org>
Cc: site-comments@w3.org
Message-ID: <PM-GA.20091015132937.6130D.1.1D@semsol.com>

Hi Ian,
Thanks for the reply. And sorry for kicking off this thread. My 
initial conclusion was actually more like *if* RDF could be easily
embedded in HTML, your team would have done it right away (as seen
with the hCalendar additions). It's just an interesting observation
(and the RDF community should take notice). Whether the W3C should 
generally put some *extra* effort into showcasing its standards 
when possible is a separate question. If RDF data is going to be 
linked from central pages (eventually, after the more urgent issues
have been addressed), then we RDFers should be satisfied. I'm sure 
there are many W3C technologies that aren't directly used by the
site at all.


Benjamin Nowack

On 14.10.2009 11:20:06, Ian Jacobs wrote:
>On 14 Oct 2009, at 4:07 AM, Benjamin Nowack wrote:
>> Ah, touché. Public rants instead of constructive criticism are really
>> not nice, sorry. So, first, congrats for aiming at a more streamlined
>> site!
>Thank you!
>> Some (hopefully helpful) comments:
>> * The emboss effect on the logo is nice and trendy, but totally
>>  destroys the nifty 3D effect of the "C" in W3C.
>> * We are all using non-semantic CSS "cheats", but the W3C really
>>  shouldn't. Try to get rid of @class values such as "tPadding0" to
>>  not give annoying nitpickers like me an opportunity to complain ;)
>>  (Keith Alexander even found <h3 class="h4"> on the site, ahem.)
>It's not clear to me at all after this project that purely "semantic"  
>CSS is useful.
>There are many cases where I really only want to talk about  
>presentation (e.g,. when talking
>about the grid layout). I think a "mix" is appropriate and maintainable.
>> * I'd try to avoid boilerplates. Maybe only make the (completed)
>>  site sections public, and wait with activating navigation items
>>  until the associated pages are done. You could still have a
>>  "list of incomplete pages" to gather community input.
>We have grand ambitions for content, but did not get all that we  
>wanted in a timely fashion. We thought the launch would help get us  
>> * Speaking as a semweb "lobbyist": If the Semantic Web is a core
>>  objective of the W3C, and if it has any value outside of Life
>>  Sciences, Gov, or Intelligence areas, then the site should utilize
>>  it, too. Why can't I sparql for all Widget-related W3C specs, or
>>  subscribe to a feed about progress in the CSS/WAI/Mobile/XML realm?
>>  What about RDF export? We RDFers are regularly accused of being
>>  snake oil salesmen. The new site as it stands now proofs them
>>  right.
>We use lots of RDF to manage the site (most of it public). I'd support  
>a SPARQL search capability on the TRs. I'm sure we'll have increasing  
>number of sem web features moving forward.
>We focused first on information architecture, design, and usability.
>> * The hCalendar microformats are broken: some have proper ISO
>>  dates but the wrong item flag (@class=event instead of vevent),
>>  others have vevent, but no ISO dates.
>I'll have a look at that.
>> * What about switching to HTML5? This would surely have a huge
>>  marketing effect. And maybe even with embedded Microdata/RDF?
>As HTML 5 moves forward towards standard we may very well get there.  
>Right now there would not be a big advantage to using HTML 5.
>> I don't know if there is any budget for this type of stuff,
>You make a good point right there!
>> but
>> I'd love to contribute some RDF export capability (you seem to
>> be using PHP for the templates?).
>Our source templates are in PHP. We generate xhtml fragments from  
>those and piece those
>together in static pages. (We also have some PHP pages that use the  
>PHP templates directly.)
>> This could be done from the
>> existing templates, too, btw. If the templates are somewhat stable,
>> we wouldn't need RDFa or Microdata to write an RDF extractor. This
>> could be done separately and you'd only have to include a link tag
>> into the HTML templates. http://www.w3.org/TR/ could then for
>> example be enhanced with a faceted browser (filter by year/tech/...)
>> to increase usability and show some SemWeb tech in action.
>I appreciate the offer to help. In most cases, as I mentioned, the RDF  
>that we are using is already publicly available. There are a few other  
>bits that I can certainly make available once we iron out the bug  
>reports that are currently flowing in...
>  _ Ian
>Ian Jacobs (ij@w3.org)    http://www.w3.org/People/Jacobs/
>Tel:                                      +1 718 260 9447
Received on Thursday, 15 October 2009 11:30:08 UTC

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