Re: modal logic, rdf and category theory

In terms of hashing the triple, note that hashing does not work on abstract
semantics, but on bitstrings. This requires all URIs to be resolved,
whitespace normalized, blank nodes represented the *exact* same way,  etc.
Is there a standard way to do this?

In general, this is hard, see how XML Digital Signatures screwed it up
after being in standardization for years under quite competent
cryptographers, and I haven't seen an approach in the academic literature
(or Linked Data Signatures/Verified Credentials) that actually goes all the
way down to the bitstring level consistently. It would be good to do.

  yours,
      harry


On Wed, Sep 5, 2018 at 2:35 AM, Krzysztof Janowicz <janowicz@ucsb.edu>
wrote:

> On 09/04/2018 05:27 PM, Simon.Cox@csiro.au wrote:
>
> Ø  the awkward reification structure survived (sadly, in retrospect).
>
>
>
> Never replaced by anything better though, so any application that needs to
> make statements about statements is driven back to it.
>
> In the last couple of weeks in my case …
>
>
> You can also hash a triple and use the resulting URI as the subject of the
> triple about this hashed triple. Of course, this comes with some
> limitations wrt the SPARQL queries you can run.
>
>
>
>
> *From:* Dan Brickley [mailto:danbri@danbri.org <danbri@danbri.org>]
> *Sent:* Tuesday, 4 September, 2018 18:32
> *To:* Pat Hayes <phayes@ihmc.us> <phayes@ihmc.us>
> *Cc:* Story Henry <henry.story@bblfish.net> <henry.story@bblfish.net>;
> Semantic Web <semantic-web@w3.org> <semantic-web@w3.org>; Benjamin Braatz
> <bb@bbraatz.eu> <bb@bbraatz.eu>; public-philoweb@w3.org
> *Subject:* Re: modal logic, rdf and category theory
>
>
>
>
>
> On Tue, 4 Sep 2018, 08:51 Pat Hayes, <phayes@ihmc.us> wrote:
>
> On 9/3/18 3:27 PM, Henry Story wrote:
>
>
>
> The paper you cite below,
>
> 2010 Context Representation on the Semantic Web
> Bao, Jie, Tao, Jiao, McGuinness, Deborah L. and Smart, Paul (2010)
> https://eprints.soton.ac.uk/270829/
>
> was the earlier work I was thinking of here.
> >
> > I started out very early being made aware of Guha's Phd thesis
> > "Contexts: A Formalization and Some Applications"
> > http://www-formal.stanford.edu/guha/
> > But I read it quickly 15 years ago, and should perhaps study it more
> carefully now. As I
> > understand he was one of the people at the origin of RDF.
>
> True, but...
>
>   So it looks to me like contexts
> > are there from the beginning.
>
> ...not so. That is, nothing in the genesis of RDF or the first
> Working Group efforts (resulting in the 2004 standard) considered
> contexts or tried to get any context mechanism into RDF. RDF
> might have been more useful if we had, in retrospect.
>
>
>
> The first first RDF group, fwiw, ran 1997-99 and gave us a Model and
> Syntax specification with a notion of reification supported both within the
> abstract graph but also syntactically. It had a ton of problems, hence the
> rdfcore WG charter which followed. We constrained it to be a cleanup rather
> than total reinvention, so the awkward reification structure survived
> (sadly, in retrospect).
>
>
>
> What pressure there was to 'expand' RDF was in the direction of
> making it as expressive as conventional FOL rather than a context
> logic. Guha and I wrote the L-base proposal with this in mind,
> for example. TimBL's N3 is in the same spirit, with explicit
> quantifiers and scope markers.
>
> >
> > In fact I always supposed that the semantic web was going in that
> direction, and
> > this intuition was confirmed when I discovered Tim Berners-Lee's and Dan
> Connolly's
> > N3 language very early one, which already at the time allowed one to be
> more elegant
> > about context.
>
> ? N3 has no context machinery in it at all. It is basically
> a(nother!) syntax for FOL.
>
> >
> > Indeed in April 2006, I wrote a blog post showing how one could deal
> with temporally
> > constrained graphs by using an N3 rule to rewrite them.
> > "Keeping track of Context in Life and on the Web"
> > https://web.archive.org/web/20060626031531/http://blogs.
> sun.com:80/roller/page/bblfish?entry=it_s_all_about_context
> <https://web.archive.org/web/20060626031531/http:/blogs.sun.com:80/roller/page/bblfish?entry=it_s_all_about_context>
> >
> > I actually show some N3 rules being applied by CWM in that blog post to
> a context
> > in order to transform a graph with a temporal relation that depends on
> the context
> > into one that does not depend on that temporal context.
>
> You keep talking about 'context' here, but that does not make any
> of this into anything like a context Logic. N3 has no LOGICAL
> MACHINERY for talking about contexts (contrast McCarthy's context
> logic, Guha's thesis and its realization in CycL, or the ICL
> logic developed for use in the IKRIS project.)  Just using the
> C-word when talking about collections of ordinary logical
> sentences muddles the issue. To reason with and about contexts
> requires /some/ kind of actual context logic, where contexts are
> real entities which are described, or at least referred to, in
> the logic itself. Without that, the word 'context' really has no
> clear meaning at all. For more on this general topic, see
>
> http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.
> 98.4812&rep=rep1&type=pdf
>
> and
>
> https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/4899/493c11d2e803bb86ef6b849fb7b318
> 5be1e3.pdf
>
> >
> > Looking for documentation on N3 I just discovered
> > that Tim Berners, Lee Dan Connolly, Lalana Kagal, Yosi Scharf and Jim
> Hendler
> > wrote a paper that  same year
> > "N3Logic: A Logical Framework For the World Wide Web"
> > http://dig.csail.mit.edu/2006/Papers/TPLP/n3logic-tplp.pdf
> >
> > SPARQL seems to have formalized (in what to me seems often a much less
> elegant way)
> > the pattern matching mechanism of N3. It is also known that SPARQL can
> be used
> > as a rule language in a way very similar to the log:implies of N3. The
> nice thing
> > about N3 is that one always sticks to the triple structure of rdf, which
> makes it
> > very elegant.
> >
> > There is an interesting question if one can ever escape contexts at all.
> It certainly
> > looks like it will be very unlikely that people will work out the right
> abstractions
> > that take all contexts into account.
> >
> > Thanks to Google Scholar I followed up easily on the article by Guha you
> mentioned
> > and found some interesting papers.
> >
> > 2010 Context Representation on the Semantic Web
> > Bao, Jie, Tao, Jiao, McGuinness, Deborah L. and Smart, Paul (2010)
> > https://eprints.soton.ac.uk/270829/
> >
> > Is very interesting not least because it shows how one could build a more
> > sophisticated notion of contexts on top of N3 or Quad Stores. Most
> interesting
> > of all to this thread is that it argues that one could help specify
> logical
> > levels using Institution Theory that I mentioned earlier. (And it does
> so quickly
> > while explaining in plain english what some of the formulas mean)
> >
> >
> >>> If the semantics of current RDF has not got this part quite right it
> seems to be there in the syntax from the beginning, since a RDF/XML
> document can contain another RDF/XML document
> >> ?In what sense of "contain"?
> >
> > Well a predicate can be related to an RDF Literal which of course needs
> to be interpreted.
>
> But RDF literals are typed, and the type - in all cases but one,
> a datatype - specifies the interpretation.
>
> <Later> OK, I see where you might be going with this. If we say
> that an RDF/XML literal denotes an RDF graph, then a triple with
> such a literal as object could encode an assertion about that
> graph. Yes, that could be done. But it hasn't been done, I should
> perhaps emphasize.</Later>
>
> >
> > <?xml version="1.0" encoding="utf-8" ?>
> > <rdf:RDF xmlns:rdf="http://www.w3.org/1999/02/22-rdf-syntax-ns#
> <http://www.w3.org/1999/02/22-rdf-syntax-ns>"
> >           xmlns:ns0="http://example.com/">
> > <rdf:Description rdf:about="http://example.com/LauraLane#i">
> >     <ns0:says rdf:parseType="Literal">
> >        <rdf:RDF xmlns:rdf="http://www.w3.org/1999/02/22-rdf-syntax-ns#
> <http://www.w3.org/1999/02/22-rdf-syntax-ns>"
> >                xmlns:ns0="http://example.com/">
> >            <rdf:Description rdf:about="http://example.com/LauraLane#i">
> >                <ns0:disklikes rdf:resource="http://example.
> com/ClarkKent#geek"/>
> >            </rdf:Description>
> >       </rdf:RDF>
> >     </ns0:says>
> > </rdf:Description>
> > </rdf:RDF>
> >
> >
> >
> >>
> >>> , and presumably the point is not to automatically merge the embedded
> document with the one it is contained in. So what is the meaning of the
> embedded graph? Well it has to be some interpretation that satisfies the
> graph. But there could be many full interpretations in part because
> >>> one can only ever work out Finite interpretations (because the
> semantic web is incomplete) and these are compatible with very many full
> interpretations.
> >>
> >> I confess to not following your thinking here. AFAIK, the RDF WG
> discussions never considered the idea of one RDF document "containing"
> another in any semantically meaningful way.
> >
> > It allows a document to contain an XML Literal. If that XML Literal is
> an RDF/XML literal
> > it follows that it can be interpreted just the same way as any other
> document. But if one is
> > to map that intelligently into a quad store one would map that as a
> graph linked to from the first one,
> > such as
> >
> > :LauraLane :says { :LauraLane :dislikes :ClarkKent } .
>
> But this is nowhere mandated by /any/ RDF standard, and I suspect
> it never will be.
>
> >
> > At the time there were no quad stores to do this type of transformation,
> but it would not
> > be wrong.
>
> Well, 'wrong' is a strong word. But it would be unjustified, and
> not used in any extant RDF tool, and would not transfer to any
> other RDF surface syntax.
>
> And well it would not take a lot to create a literal that had
> that interpretation
> > for RDF/XML.
>
> There is an issue, though. The same content - same RDF graph -
> could be represented in, say, Turtle or N-triples or even
> JSON-LD. But the corresponding literals would look entirely
> different. They would all have to have different datatypes. Which
> is possible, but kind of clunky.
>
> I suggest that this line of thinking is going to get lost in
> syntactic weeds. You would do better to just start with quads and
> try to make them into what you are looking for without going via
> embedded literals. Or even adopting some version of the named
> graph convention. Just my 2c.
>
>
> >
> >>> But also because documents can be published to mislead ("fake news")
> software into believing the universe is other than it is.
> >>
> >> Well, of course. Publication on the Web has never been a guarantee of
> truth or accuracy, and RDF doesn't change that fact of social life.
> >>
> >>> I have a short blog post "Phishing in Context - Epistemology of the
> Screen" that goes into this
> >>> where I make clear the importance of context, and how some good
> salesman arbitrarily named Donald
> >>> can try to use confusions of context as bait
> >>> https://medium.com/cybersoton/phishing-in-context-9c84ca451314
> >>> Another simple logic of Contexts is the well known work by Mike
> Burrows (who wrote the AltaVista search engine), Martin Abadi, Butler
> Lampson, Gordon Plotkin from 1993 "A calculus for access control in
> distributed systems" https://dl.acm.org/citation.cfm?id=155225
> >>> Quad stores (RDF Datasets) can clearly be used as a foundation to
> build such things on.
> >>
> >> True. However, quad stores have no universally accepted semantics, so
> it will not be easy to standardize any of this.
> >
> > It's actually quite easy.
>
> You misunderstand me. It may be fairly easy to invent a set of
> conventions for quads which do what you want them to do. But quad
> stores are an established, even by now an old, technology, and
> they are out there being used in many different ways. Large
> amounts of developer time and money have been committed to these
> uses. To get a STANDARD which assigns a SINGLE semantics to quad
> stores is now effectively impossible. (It was already impossible
> in 2012, when the RDF 1.1 WG was chartered.) You will not get the
> W3C to charter it; and even if someone did that, and it became a
> W3C Recommendation, nobody would pay that any real attention. It
> is a social problem, not a technical one; and far from being
> easy, it is effectively impossible.
>
> The semantics of a graph is the set of interpretations for which
> it is
> > true. There are a few variables there:
> >
> > 1) the set IR of resources can be different. For example in our world
> the set may contain
> > books about Superman, and Laura Lane but no agents with those properties.
> > Whereas in the fictional spaces of those books those Characters do exist
> as resources
> > with special properties.  But it may also contain resources about
> Hillary Clinton and
> > weird pizzarias with basements that in our world don't exist - but that
> do in the imagination
> > of quite a few americans, that have lead some to act on those beliefs,
> and many to vote.
>
> Indeed. How, or indeed whether, to deal with imaginary entities
> in formal ontologies is a much debated topic. My own view - in
> sharp contrast to the more established view often identified as
> Quinean - is that the logic must treat all entities similarly, so
> that to be in the universe of discourse means only that something
> has been /referred to by someone/, and that this is recognized as
> not /necessarily/ implying real existence. So we can all talk
> about what other people are talking about, and even perhaps
> debate with them, without thereby committing ourselves to agree
> that what they are talking about is in fact real. (The Horatio
> Principle: there are more things in heaven and earth than are
> dreamt of in /your/ ontology.) But I admit this is a
> controversial position. And I expect that I agree with you that
> having an explicit treatment of contexts would be a good first
> step towards a more sophisticated approach to this whole issue.
>
> >
> > 2) the conventional interpretations accepted for the URIs used as
> subject and object.
> >    A URI could mean anything before it is coined. For example the URL
> for owl:sameAs could have
> >    been any number of other URIs.
> >
> > 3) the various interpretations due to the possibility of blank nodes
> being assigned to different
> >     resources in each of those universes.
> >
> > The set of those interpretations is the meaning of the graph. If the
> Interpretation considered to
> > be the actual one is in there then the graph is true.
> >
> > So we can understand what
> >
> > :HillaryClinton :in :Paris;
> >      :hears { :HillaryClinton :in :Boston }
> >
> > And even though the graph quoted contradicts the external one, we know
> what it would
> > mean for it to be true, but we (may) also know that it is not.
> >
> >>
> >>> If you think as agents that write RDF graphs as processes, then you
> can see how this is coalgebraic.
> >>> Different such processes are writing from partial information
> situations in different contexts, and
> >>> with potentially antagonistic aims. Context matters.
> >>
> >> I think that you are here using "context" informally, whereas I was
> using it rather more formally, referring to context logics such as CycL.
> >
> > yes, I may have been thinking all one needs is graphs for contexts. It
> certainly
> > seems to be an essential ingredient, as the article "Context
> Representation on the Semantic Web"
> > argues. And I now see there is a whole literature on more sophisticated
> notions of context.
>
> I think the notion is similar, but the issue is that if you want
> to have engines drawing conclusions about contexts, you need some
> actual context /machinery/, and probably some logical context
> machinery.
>
> >
> >>
> >>>> Right at the end of the RDF 1.1 semantics document there is indeed a
> tiny mention of the possibility of some future extension of RDF using a
> modal interpretation of RDF datasets (basically quad stores). But any such
> interpretation would require a major change to the semantics (analogous to
> the extension of Tarskian model theory to the Kripke semantics for modal
> logics) and some kind of enrichment of the RDF syntax to provide some way
> to indicate the syntactic scope of any modal operator. RDF graph syntax has
> no scope marking, a fact that gave the RDF and OWL WGs many technical
> challenges.
> >>>> (For further discussion of this point and what could be done about
> it, see
> >>>> https://www.slideshare.net/PatHayes/blogic-iswc-2009-invited-talk
> >>>> starting from slide 15.)
> >>> Very interesting set of slides. Here are some thoughts from my
> research in CT.
> >>> • Slide 10 on names
> >>>    The difference here is between names as syntactic, denotational
> semantic and operations semantic
> >>> terms.
> >>
> >> If I understand you here (I might well not...) then I disagree. The
> issue I was trying to describe in that slide is the fact that referring
> names on the Web are what one might call socially non-arbitrary. They are
> more like names in natural language than logical identifiers, in this
> regard. But this has nothing to do with the nature of the entities they
> refer to.
> >
> > yes, David Lewis in "Convention" explains how languages gain their
> meanings using co-operative Game Theory. It is a very nice read. In the
> case of the web the game is partly determined by the fact that
> > one can dereference the URI. That is the fastest, easiest method to find
> out something about it.
>
> Careful. About what, exactly? What an IRI /denotes/ might be
> completely different from what you get when you dereference it.
> Google "HttpRange-14" for an amazing amount of debate and
> discussion about this. Many IRIs - I think most IRIs used in RDF
> - do not denote time-dependent things.
>
>   And
> > practical considerations are not unimportant in helping people choose
> between equivalent conventions.
> >
> >> The syntactic view of names that algebraic views of logic have is the
> one espoused by the RDF specs. These are indeed interchangeable.
> >
> > Well that is also true. At the beginning of the Web any URI can mean
> anything. Then the process of
> > convention starts and determines the actual language of the web.
> >
> >>
> >> But they aren't, because the same IRIs get used in non-logical contexts
> as well, and while a renaming might preserve the purely logical meaning it
> will not preserve the meaningful relationships to these other uses. But in
> any case, logical renaming requires ALL uses of the name to be replaced in
> one step, and the Web - even the purely formal part of it encoded in RDF -
> is too large and scattered for this to ever be possible.
> >
> > exactly. That is the process that stabilizes the language - David Lewis
> uses the word Metastable 3 times in his book. But that is true of all
> languages, not just the web.
>
> Indeed. My point in that slide is that the IRIs used in RDF are
> now words in a human language in Lewis' sense, but the formal
> semantics does not face up to the reality of this.
> >
> >>
> >>>    But the Semantic web is an evolutionary *process* that starts at a
> certain stage and develops,
> >>> where different players have only a partial view on its evolution.
> Coalgebras represent the mathematics of states (that evolve) and
> observation as the subtitle of Bart Jacobs' recent book on Coalgebras
> points out clearly
> >>> https://www.cambridge.org/core/books/introduction-to-coalgebra/
> 0D508876D20D95E17871320EADC185C6
> >>>    The Web itself is coalgebraic, since resources that URIs refer to
> are things that change *State*.
> >>
> >> Not all of them. And indeed, using a URI to /refer to/ (as opposed to
> /identify/, using RESTful HTTP) something with a changing state is in many
> ways non-"cool", in TimBL's phrase.
> >
> > URLs (without the hash and ignoring redirects) refer to information
> resources that have
> > state and that can change over time. Their referent are states of
> objects that can be observed
> > through representations that can change over time.
>
> Wrong. Or at any rate, wrong in many cases. This is not true of
> pretty much any IRI of the form dbpedia.org/resource/.
> <http://dbpedia.org/resource/>..  for
> example. It is also not true for any of the XML Schema datatype
> IRIs. Nor for https://www.ihmc.us/users/phayes/PatHayesAbout.html
>
> To repeat: what an IRI denotes, and what you get when you
> dereference it, are two very different things. They might be the
> same in some cases, but in most cases they are not.
>
>   That is what I mean by these being
> > coalgebraic. As such the referent of those names don't change: they
> refer to the stream
> > - the changing stream.
> >
> > What Tim means by cool URIs don't change is not that the representation
> does not change - but
> > that they don't change in ways that change the topic so that people
> referring to them could
> > argue that you have changed the meaning of the documents linking to your
> content. Ie: the identity
> > criterion for what constitutes representations that are the same as the
> previous ones is a socially
> > constructed notion of identity. Seriously changing the meaning is to let
> down those linking to you.
> > And it could have legal consequences.
>
> Or, in a nutshell, the 'S' in 'REST" means 'state'. Right?
>
> >
> > I have an illustration of how this works here
> > https://math.stackexchange.com/questions/2896172/how-
> should-one-model-rdf-semantics-in-terms-of-category-theory
> >
> >>
> >>> These are things that return representations (algebraically
> interpretable objects).
> >>>    Hence the fight between many logicians and Linked Data folks may
> just be a case of a categorical
> >>> misapprehension between people working in a dual category.
> >>
> >> Perhaps, but I think it goes deeper than that.
> >>>       Anyway we agree here about names and the importance of
> reference. And I think the
> >>> categorical duality here can help give us a mathematical
> representation of the web that shows how
> >>> these two sides can work together.
> >>> • Slide 18 on blank nodes
> >>>       Interestingly here you note that the problem is with a set
> theoretic definition of blank nodes
> >>> that are global. Benjamin Braatz in his 2009 thesis
> >>> "Formal Modelling and Application of Graph Transformations in the
> Resource Description Framework"
> >>> https://www.depositonce.tu-berlin.de/bitstream/11303/
> 2617/2/Dokument_29.pdf
> >>> of which the first half is very readable for someone with knowledge of
> RDF.
> >>> gave a Category Theoretic model of RDF where each graph comes with its
> own blank node set, and
> >>> the only way to identify such nodes is by morphisms. This is actually
> an advantage of a category
> >>> theoretic way of looking things that tends to put less emphasis on
> identity and a lot more on morphisms.
> >>>     Still it looks like RDF1.1 allows blank nodes across contexts
> >>
> >> It doesn't mention contexts but it does allow for graphs to share
> bnodes, in particular, graphs in a single dataset. So yes, in effect.
> >>
> >>
> >>> (as I gather from 5.1.1),
> >>> which would be a way to make statements de Re about someone's beliefs,
> eg:
> >>>    Laura Lane believes of Superman that he cannot fly.
> >>> _:superman = :SuperMan .
> >>> :LL believes { _:superman a :NonFlyingPerson;
> >>>                       foaf:name "Clark Kent" } .
> >>> I wonder how much the blank node sharing would require changes to
> Benjamin Braatz'
> >>> thesis.
> >>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> It is to me very clear that RDF has a modal aspect to it, which
> comes out very clearly
> >>>>> with Quad stores.
> >>>>
> >>>> That is totally unclear to me. Quad stores can be, and have been,
> used to represent all kinds of 'extra' content, including graphs with
> time-stamping or location-stamping or representing states of something or
> linking information about a person or topic to that person or topic. None
> of this is modal.
> >>> Well all of these are thought of as modal logics.
> >>
> >> No no no! Please don't get this muddled. A logic with times in it is
> NOT a modal tense logic, and a logic which mentions belief contexts
> explicitly is NOT a modal belief logic. The modalities occur, and are
> required, when the logic does NOT mention the 'parameters' of truth
> explicitly. So, for example, modal TENSE logic does not have expressions
> denoting times, but instead has modal operators for future and past tenses.
> There is an unspoken convention that any plain assertion made without the
> modalites is supposed to be true 'now'. As soon as you put times into the
> mix, the modalities become redundant and can be expalined away as simple
> quantified assertions, so that
> >>
> >> PAST(Full-Professor(PatHayes))
> >>
> >> would turn into something like
> >>
> >> (exists (T)(Earlier(T, NOW) & Full-Professor(PatHayes, T) )
> >>
> >> where we mention the 'now' explicitly. And this is no longer a modal
> logic: it's just conventional logic with an ontology of ties embedded into
> it. The same kind of thing happens with all the other modalities (though de
> dicto stuff in quantified belief logics does get a bit hairy.) In fact,
> context logic can be seen as a general-purpose device for /eliminating/
> modalities and reducing all modal constructions to a non-modal framework.
> For lots more on this, see
> >> https://www.ihmc.us/users/phayes/IKL/GUIDE/GUIDE.html
> >> especially ...#ContextsModalities.
> >
> > I will need to look at this more closely.
> >
> > But I think there is an indexical element with any statement/graph in
> RDF, namely it's truth depends
> > on what the actual world is. This is of course impossible to completely
> describe, and
> > furthermore there are important disagreements as to its description. So
> though I think we
> > should agree that the actual world is objectively decidable, it won't
> help to ignore the indexical
> > role it plays. And this does not alter the meaning of a graph: its
> meaning is objective
> > (if  we idealise here as before, and ignore potential disagreements as
> to the meaning of terms),
> > and is the set of interpretations as argued above.
> >
> > The advantage of this is that I can argue and make sense of Sherlock
> Holmes by taking the
> > set IR of resources that best describe his partial world as the actual
> one when he speaks.
> > That will help me make sense of the story.
> > See "Truth in Fiction" http://andrewmbailey.com/dkl/
> >
> > But it also helps make sense of contemporary politics, as well as of
> thieves, liars and professional
> > con men/women, Phishers and others whose aim is to change their victim's
> perception
> > of the actual world enough to entrap them.
> >
> >
> >>
> >>> My guess is that the concept that
> >>> ties all modal logics together is the concept of context.
> >>
> >> That's about as wrong as it can get, in fact. See above.
> >>
> >>
> >>> It would be interesting
> >>> to see if there is a proof of that...
> >>>>
> >>>>> But it looks like this may need proving - or perhaps someone has
> already
> >>>>> done so? Modal logic need not I suppose involve possible worlds, and
> the interesting thing
> >>>>> is that Category Theories believe to have proven that modal logic is
> to coalgebras what
> >>>>> equational reasoning is to algebras.  See "Modal Logics are
> Coalgebraic" for a summary
> >>>>> https://academic.oup.com/comjnl/article-abstract/54/1/31/336864
> >>
> >> That is, unfortunately, behind a rather high paywall. If you have a
> link to an open published version, please give it.
> >
> > Sorry. Here it is available for all
> > https://eprints.soton.ac.uk/267144/1/ModalCoalgRev.pdf
>
> Thanks.
>
> >
> >>
> >>>>> Coalgebras give us the mathematics of infinite streams, processes, a
> notion of co-induction,
> >>>>> and are to semantics what algebra is to syntax.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> All RDF semantics tells us is how to merge two graphs when one
> believes them both
> >>>>> to be true.
> >>>>
> >>>> Not quite "all", but your introduction of "believes" is gratuitous.
> The RDF (and OWL) semantics saying nothing about believing or beliefs.
> >>> Yes, that's because I am thinking in terms of using these specs by
> writing User Agents that need to
> >>> help the User work with the published graphs encountered on the web in
> order to arrange meetings,
> >>> buy products, etc... So I take a pragmatic action oriented view of
> these specs.
> >>> Here R. Brandom, a student of David Lewis, whose thesis was on
> Impossible Worlds, and who went on
> >>> from there to develop a philosophy of Analytic Pragmatism, is well
> worth looking at. He uses pragmatism
> >>> I think to sidestep the idealisation of possible worlds, by instead
> speaking of the logical consequences an actor is bound to by making a
> statement. Such statements can of course be contradictory, which is why
> this is a process oriented view of possibilities, as I understand.
> >>> But nevertheless, the spec would say that the two graphs have
> compatible interpretations. Since any graph can have any number of
> interpretations, this is saying that there some number of models that makes
> them true. But then if there is set of model that makes them true, that may
> not be a model the actor dealing with that graph believes to be true
> >>
> >> Um... that does not make sense. Models(in this sense) aren't true or
> not true, they are representations of the way that the world could be
> arranged so as to make some /sentences/ (RDF graphs) true.
> >
> > yes :-)
> >
> >>
> >>> - ie one he would act on. Though he may be keen to use the
> misapprehension of the actor with that belief to take advantage of that
> situation.
> >>> Which is pretty much how Phishing works.
> >>>>
> >>>>> But what if one believes that someone else believes them to be true?
> >>>>
> >>>> And how is that nested modality to be represented in a form that can
> be transmitted across the Web? You need to explain how RDF syntax can be
> extended to cover this kind of assertion.
> >>> One does not need to transmit it over the web for it to be useful.
> >>
> >> But we are here talking about extending RDF (aren't we?) in some way,
> and that extension /does/ need to be transmittable over the Web. That is
> the whole point of defining these languages.
> >
> > yes. Just pointing out that I can gather a number of simple RDF graphs
> from the web
> > and already start using them using evidence logic, which are described
> in a chapter of
> > Eric Pacuit's recent book "Neighborhood Semantics for Modal Logics" in
> 1.4.4 a Logic of Evidence and
> > Belief. The idea is that every graph should count just as evidence for
> various propositions and
> > actions.
>
> Well, you CAN do that, but that isn't how the vast bulk of
> RDF-coded linked data is in fact treated, as far as I know. Maybe
> this will some to be needed when, if ever, RDF is used to encode
> something more than simple data.
>
> >
> >>
> >>> If I have an
> >>> application that merges different graphs and presents this to the user
> it should be
> >>> possible for the user to be surprised about a conclusion reached, ask
> then where
> >>> the information came from, and potentially remove some graphs that he
> finds dubious.
> >>
> >> All true, but AFAI can see, has nothing to do with extending RDF to be
> modal.
> >
> > Does the argument that the actual world being indexical makes it
> interpretable as modal
> > help convince you?
>
> Not really, but then I don't really understand that argument, or
> in what sense you say that the actual world is indexical.
>
> >
> > David Lewis showed that one can map counterfactual statements to first
> order logic as
> > long as one can quantify over possible worlds. Translated to this
> context this would mean
> > that we can quantify over interpretations.
>
> Hmm. I don't think this actually makes sense. Try to sketch what
> such a logic would look like. To quantify over interpretations,
> you need a way to /refer/ to interpretations. I don't think it is
> internally coherent to have a logic which has names which refer
> to the interpretations of that very logic, so that the universe
> of an interpretation includes ... interpretations? Maybe Aczel's
> set theory can handle this, but its going to get very strange.
>
>   Perhaps there is an isomorphism, in which case
> > it already is modal?
> >
> >>
> >>> But one can even with RDF/XML pass graphs inside graphs since one can
> pass an rdf literal
> >>> in an rdf graph, and that can contain an rdf literal too...
> >>> But there is also some basic ways this has been done since the
> blogosphere where they
> >>> invented the nofollow attribute when linking to something, the user
> wanted to speak about
> >>> whilst telling Google that he did not want his link to count as a +1
> for that web page.
> >>> Similarly one could have a relation relating an Agent to a content
> such as :disagrees
> >>> to keep a distance between that content and ones affirmed by the agent.
> >>
> >> Oh sure, one can imagine all kinds of ontologies of propositional
> attitudes towards content. As well as degrees of belief, numerical
> confidence scores and so on. But none of this requires any changes to the
> /logic/. OUr old 'named graph' paper had some ideas in it along these
> lines, also with detailed semantics worked out: we had to introduce a
> notion of rigid identifier (for the graph names) into the model theory to
> do it properly.
> >
> > Do you have a link to it?
>
> http://wwwconference.org/2005a/cdrom/docs/p613.pdf
>
> see especially sections 8 and 9.
>
> >
> >>
> >>>>
> >>>>> Then by merging them one can find out what they think is true, and
> one can model that
> >>>>> in terms of possible worlds, or for those more syntactically
> oriented sets of all the
> >>>>> ways of completing those graphs in ways that are consistent (or sets
> of maximally complete
> >>>>> such graphs). There is a clear modal element to that, in so far as
> one cannot
> >>>>> merge graphs of what one believes to be true into someone else's
> belief store without getting
> >>>>> a wrong idea of what they believe.
> >>>>
> >>>> But one can say all of this without mentioning the modal notion of
> belief. You are here simply talking about truth, consistency and validity
> (or otherwise) of inference on RDF graphs, but adding 'believes' instead of
> 'true' throughout.
> >>> yes, I am speaking of actors that use these graphs in order to act in
> the world. I don't believe
> >>> and I don't think anyone here believes that software has to be written
> that maps an rdf graph
> >>> to the interpretation in the world. What happens is that software
> developers map graphs to
> >>> User Interfaces in a functorial way, and these user interfaces are
> then mapped by humans in the
> >>> end to things in the world. The humans complete the interpretation
> functor by composing with the
> >>> initial one designed by the software developer.
> >>
> >> I don't think the semantic interpretation mapping is a functOR, because
> I don't believe that the real world is a category :-)
> >
> > Does the semantics not require sets? Is the world composed of sets?
>
> No, it is composed of things with relations holding between them.
> Calling this a 'set' is the minimal amount of mathematics
> necessary to describe it at all; seeing it as having any further
> structure is a form of mathematical hallucination, IMO. But I
> know I am out on a lonely limb here.
>
> > But seriously I am only putting that forward as a thought experiment to
> see where
> > it fails, in order to understand where people coming from category
> theory may be mislead
> > by trying to apply categories in an obvious way, but also to see why one
> may need more
> > complex structures like Institutions.
>
> Fair enough :-)
>
> >
> >>
> >>> I give a simplistic but at least intuitive view of how such a
> functorial notion of semantics can
> >>> be understood to work in the math exchange question
> >>> https://math.stackexchange.com/questions/2896172/how-
> should-one-model-rdf-semantics-in-terms-of-category-theory
> >>> I need to develop that a lot more of course...
> >>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> So if this still needs to be proven
> >>>>
> >>>> What exactly "needs to be proven" ?
> >>> I suppose that RDF1.1 with datasets is compatible with modal logic.
> Though I
> >>> have a feeling that Kripke modal logic is too simple and even David
> Lewisian
> >>> modal logic which is a neighborhood semantics based one is not quite
> right.
> >>> In the newly published book "Category Theory for the Working
> Philosopher"
> >>> https://books.google.de/books?id=RIM8DwAAQBAJ
> >>> there are many very intersting articles. One by Abramski on
> Contextuality and
> >>> Paradox. But also the one by Kohei Kishida on "Categories and
> Modalities"
> >>> which looks a neighborhood semantics with impossible worlds and shows
> >>> how that can be understood in terms of category theory.
> >>> I have not yet fully digested all these different pieces. But I hope
> this
> >>> gives some idea as to the work one could draw on to further the
> semantic web
> >>> and the web in general by placing it on even firmer formal foundations.
> >>
> >> Well, good luck. I confess to not, myself, finding Category Theory much
> use in providing any useful insights; it seems to be a whole lot of jargon
> describing very little, compared to the simplicity and elegance of the
> usual set-theoretic picture. The Wikipedia article on Coalgebras (which I
> looked at to help me understand what you were talking about earlier) is a
> good example. What in this
> >> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coalgebra
> >> provides ANY useful insight AT ALL into what we are discussing? It
> defines a coalgebra as a vector space, for a start. What do vector spaces
> have to do with RDF, modal logic or the Web?
> >
> > yes, that is not a very good introduction.
> >
> > Corina Cirstea's article is much better and so is
> > "Universal Coalgebras: A theory of Systems"
> > http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.
> 159.2020&rep=rep1&type=pdf
> >
> > as well as Bart Jacobs, Jan Rutten "A tutorial on (co) algebras and (co)
> induction"
> > https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/40bb/e9978e2c4080740f55634ac58033bf
> b37d36.pdf
> >
> > He has a lot of excellent articles from the 1990ies showing how OO
> programming
> > is coalgebraic. But he also has an article showing how there is a
> duality between
> > OO programming and modal logics with operators
> > http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/summary?doi=10.1.1.40.7008
> > ( much more difficult but it shows how this can help bridge branches
> > that would seem incompatible)
> >
> > Benjamin Braatz' thesis is an algebraic approach to RDF, and the first
> half
> > would be close to your heart, as he has blank nodes tied to graphs,
> which is
> > a way to make your metaphorical idea of surfaces real.
> >
> > One of the key things of Category Theory is that it emphasizes structure
> above
> > elements. And most amazingly it is based on the same notion of a graph
> that
> > RDF uses. That is what is so weird about it. Category theory is less
> interested
> > in identity as it is in translation or isomorphism. So that is why it is
> very good
> > at finding deep symmetries between very different parts of mathematics,
> as well
> > as showing how the same structure is found across mathematical and
> logical domains.
>
> OK, I know it is foundational in mathematics, but Web logic isn't
> primarily a mathematical topic. The actual metamathematics of
> logic (certainly of RDF) is very simple, almost trivial. It
> doesnt need anything high-powered to grasp it. And the
> subject-matter of Web logic isn't mathematical at all. The worlds
> that linked data describes have essentially no generalizable
> mathematical structure.
>
> But whatever, I don't mean to have an argument about this. If you
> can find insight in category theory, good luck with it :-) Thanks
> for the pointers, in any case.
>
> Pat
>
> > For example it turns out that one can think of programming with types in
> ways
> > that are very similar to basic algebras one learns in high school. It
> used to be
> > abstract nonsense. Now category theoreticians are doing keynotes at
> programming
> > language conferences: https://skillsmatter.com/
> skillscasts/10179-the-maths-behind-types
> >
> >>
> >> But YMMV, as I am sure it does.
> >
> > :-)
> >
> >>
> >>>>
> >>>>> it seems like Institution theory may help to do
> >>>>> so. In a very interesting paper from 2006 by Dorel Lucanu, Yuan Fang
> Li, and Jin Song Dong
> >>>>> entitled "Semantic Web Languages – Towards an Institutional
> Perspective" show how one can
> >>>>> use the theory of institutions to show how RDF, RDFS, OWL (light,
> DL,...,Full), ... that
> >>>>> seem to have very different semantics can in fact be seen to be
> consistent.
> >>>>
> >>>> The OWL specification documents show this already, in almost painful
> detail. (Well, insofar as it is correct. Some RDFS tautologies are not
> valid in any OWL dialect, for example.)
> >>> Thanks for pointing that out.
> >>> In fairness, the article "Semantic Web Languages - Towards an
> Institutional Perspective" was
> >>> published in 2006 while the document "OWL 2 Web Ontology Language
> Mapping to RDF Graphs"
> >>>      https://www.w3.org/TR/2012/REC-owl2-mapping-to-rdf-20121211/
> >>> came out in Dec 2012 so over 6 years later.
> >>
> >> Well, sure, but the same job was done in 2004 for the earlier versions
> of OWL and RDF.
> >>
> >>> I remember in the early days people doubting that these languages
> could have the same
> >>> semantics, and using that as an argument for the infeasibility of the
> semantic web.
> >>
> >> Yes. It was a very contentious matter for quite a while. The split
> between OWL-DL and OWL-Full was the product of those energetic debates.
> >>
> >> Pat
> >>
> >>>>> http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.
> 119.5368&rep=rep1&type=pdf
> >>>>> So if someone tells you that these are incompatible semantics point
> them to that paper.
> >>>>
> >>>> Or read the specifications themselves :-)
> >>> Yes, now I can point people to two such documents, and most
> interestingly for me
> >>> is I can see how the two methodologies overlap or diverge.
> >>>> Pat
> >>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> It looks like work needs to be done to show that these are also
> compatible with
> >>>>> modal logics (with neighborhood semantics is my guess: ie coalgebras
> of the form
> >>>>>      S -> S^2^2
> >>>>> a.k.a
> >>>>>      S -> 𝒫𝒫(S)
> >>>>> where 𝒫(S) is a predicate and 𝒫𝒫(S) is a set of predicates. Now
> if one thinks
> >>>>> of a graph as a predicate on possible worlds, one sees why this is
> similar to quad
> >>>>> stores. Those are known as a hyper-system as explained in "Universal
> Coalgebra: A Theory
> >>>>> of Systems" http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/
> viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.159.2020&rep=rep1&type=pdf
> >>>>>
> >>>>> As for good introductions to CT, since that was part of the topic 4
> years ago,
> >>>>> I think the best online intro (and more) for programmers are Bart
> Milewski's
> >>>>> ( https://bartoszmilewski.com/ ) videos on youtube
> >>>>> https://www.youtube.com/user/DrBartosz/playlists
> >>>>> I really recommend it. He is extremely clear without being boring.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I also liked a lot "Category Theory for Computing Science" by
> Michael Barr and
> >>>>> Charles Wells  (online http://www.tac.mta.ca/tac/
> reprints/articles/22/tr22.pdf )
> >>>>> because they make the relation of categories to Graphs so clear.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Indeed just because the relation is so striking I asked a question
> on Math
> >>>>> Stackexchange to illustrate how one could be (mis?)lead into a
> simple pattern
> >>>>> of thinking of the relationship
> >>>>>
> >>>>> https://math.stackexchange.com/questions/2896172/how-
> should-one-model-rdf-semantics-in-terms-of-category-theory
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Has anyone come across further developments in this space since then?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Henry Story
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> On 17 Apr 2014, at 20:02, Obrst, Leo J. <lobrst@mitre.org> wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Back a few years, emerging from the old IEEE Standard Upper
> Ontology group’s work was Bob Kent’s Information Flow Framework, an
> ontology framework (a meta-level framework) based on Barwise & Seligman’s
> Information Flow Theory, itself an application of Category Theory. See, for
> example: http://arxiv.org/pdf/1109.0983v1.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Mainly folks have used Information Flow Theory or Goguen’s notion
> of institutions as springboards from category theory to ontologies,
> especially for so-called “lattice of theories”, ontology mapping, and
> semantic interoperability applications. Work includes Mossakowski’s various
> papers: http://iws.cs.uni-magdeburg.de/~mossakow/.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> For a short “position” paper, see:
> >>>>>> Markus Kr¨otzsch, Pascal Hitzler, Marc Ehrig, York Sure. 2005.
> Category Theory in Ontology Research: Concrete Gain from an Abstract
> Approach. http://www.aifb.kit.edu/web/Techreport893.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> For RDF and category theory, the only paper I know of addresses
> graph transformations for RDF:
> >>>>>> Benjamin Braatz; Christoph Brandt. 2008. Graph Transformations for
> the Resource Description Framework. Proceedings of the Seventh
> International Workshop on Graph Transformation and Visual Modeling
> Techniques (GT-VMT 2008). http://journal.ub.tu-berlin.
> de/eceasst/article/view/158/142.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Admittedly most of the above are applications beyond logic itself
> and RDF, but might shed some light on how category theory is being used for
> ontologies.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Thanks,
> >>>>>> Leo
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> From: henry.story@bblfish.net [mailto:henry.story@bblfish.net]
> >>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, April 16, 2014 6:09 PM
> >>>>>> To: Gregg Reynolds
> >>>>>> Cc: Antoine Zimmermann; SW-forum Web; public-philoweb@w3.org
> >>>>>> Subject: Re: rdf and category theory
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> On 11 Apr 2014, at 16:32, Gregg Reynolds <dev@mobileink.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> On Fri, Apr 11, 2014 at 8:30 AM, Antoine Zimmermann <
> antoine.zimmermann@emse.fr> wrote:
> >>>>>> There're a lot of resources available online and for free about
> category theory.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Some examples:
> >>>>>>    - Jirí Adámek, Horst Herrlich, George E. Strecker. Abstract and
> Concrete Categories: The Joy of Cats (524 pages).
> http://katmat.math.uni-bremen.de/acc/acc.pdf
> >>>>>>    - Maarten M. Fokkinga. A Gentle Introduction to Category Theory:
> the calculational approach.http://wwwhome.ewi.utwente.nl/~fokkinga/mmf92b.
> pdf (80 pages).
> >>>>>>    - Jaap van Oosten. Basic Category Theory (88 pages).
> http://www.staff.science.uu.nl/~ooste110/syllabi/catsmoeder.pdf
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> One of the best is Robert Goldblatt's Topoi : The Categorial
> Analysis of Logic .  He pays special attention to linking CT concepts to
> both classic math and ordinary intuition.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> I looked through Robert Goldblatt's Topoi quickly [1] and indeed it
> is the book that covers the subject probably most relevant to the semantic
> web community, since it aims to show how logic can be derived from Category
> Theory. In this area I found reading through the first part of Ralf
> Krömer's "Tool and Object: A History and Philosophy of Category Theory" to
> also be very interesting, as it gives an overview of the foundational
> debate in Mathematics  started by CT.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> It's so odd that RDF is entirely about relations just as CT is (
> except that RDF is one to many whereas CT arrows are functions). So I
> really look forward to understanding how these two domains fit together,
> and perhaps how they complement each other.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Henry
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> [1] Having read through half of  "Conceptual Mathematics" by
> Willima Lawvere and done most of the exercises there, I am starting to be
> able to read a lot of these books much more easily.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> -Gregg
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Social Web Architect
> >>>>>> http://bblfish.net/
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>> --
> >>>> -----------------------------------
> >>>> call or text to 850 291 0667
> >>>> www.ihmc.us/groups/phayes/
> >>>> www.facebook.com/the.pat.hayes
> >>
> >> --
> >> -----------------------------------
> >> call or text to 850 291 0667
> >> www.ihmc.us/groups/phayes/
> >> www.facebook.com/the.pat.hayes
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> --
> -----------------------------------
> call or text to 850 291 0667
> www.ihmc.us/groups/phayes/
> www.facebook.com/the.pat.hayes
>
>
>
> --
> Krzysztof Janowicz
>
> Geography Department, University of California, Santa Barbara
> 4830 Ellison Hall, Santa Barbara, CA 93106-4060
>
> Email: jano@geog.ucsb.edu
> Webpage: http://geog.ucsb.edu/~jano/
> Semantic Web Journal: http://www.semantic-web-journal.net
>
>