Re: The translation of 漢字 (Was: English editing)

In GB12200.1-90 Part 01, "汉字" is translated to "Chinese character, Hanzi".
See 4.1.3.6 of that spec.

- Xidorn

On Wed, Apr 1, 2015 at 5:13 PM, Angel Li <angel@w3.org> wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> +1 to Hanzi if we already have a related national standard stating that.
> To make it more clear for a broader community, maybe we should add a
> paragraph of rational on what do we mean by Hanzi.
>
> Best,
>
> Angel
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Richard Ishida [mailto:ishida@w3.org]
> > Sent: 2015年4月1日 13:28
> > To: chen-zhuang
> > Cc: Yijun Chen; Xiaoqian Cindy Wu; 'Bobby Tung'; 慶 劉; public-zhreq
> > Subject: Re: The translation of 漢字 (Was: English editing)
> >
> > The Japanese word 'kanji' is nowadays used regularly in English for Han
> > characters used in Japanese, although this usage is usually to contrast
> with
> > hiragana/katakana. However, the Chinese word 'hanzi' is unlikely to be
> > known by most people, and it's English equivalent is generally Han
> characters,
> > or ideographic characters.
> >
> > The Unicode Standard is a good place to look for definitions and common
> > usage in English. It says:
> >
> > "Terminology. Several standard romanizations of the term used to refer to
> > East Asian ideographic characters are commonly used. They include hànzì
> > (Chinese), kanzi (Japanese), kanji (colloquial Japanese), hanja
> (Korean), and
> > Chữhán (Vietnamese). The standard English translations for these terms
> are
> > interchangeable: Han character, Han ideographic character, East Asian
> > ideographic character, or CJK ideographic character. For clarity, the
> Unicode
> > Standard uses some subset of the English terms when referring to these
> > characters."
> >
> > Note how the paragraph distinguishes between romanizations (ie.
> > non-English words) and English translations.
> >
> > The Unicode standard uses 'Han character' mostly and sometimes Han
> > ideographic character.
> >
> > hope that helps,
> > ri
> >
> > On 01/04/2015 02:43, chen-zhuang wrote:
> > > I prefered to Hanzi at begining because the terminology Hanzi was
> > > already defined in a national standard (GB XXXX-19XX, I do not
> > > remember the detail number), but I may change my mind after reading
> > > message from Ishida san.
> > > FYI:
> > > The ISO/IEC 10646 Universal Coded Character Set uses:
> > > Hanzi for whole China
> > > Kanji for Japan
> > > Hanja for N. and S. Korea
> > > ChuNom for Vietnam
> > > Chen Zhuang
> > > China Electronics Standardization Institute
> > > 在2015年03月31 20时45分, "Richard Ishida"<ishida@w3.org>写道:
> > >
> > >     On 31/03/2015 13:38, Yijun Chen wrote:
> > >      >> Yes, i'm glad you brought this up, since i wondered about that
> > >     too. I
> > >      >> left the translation as Hanzi for now, but that's really not a
> > >      >> translation, it's more of a transliteration of the Chinese (and
> > >     should
> > >      >> probably have a lowercase H). I would prefer to change it.
> > >      >
> > >      > The reason I used Hanzi was because the term ‘Kanji’ shows up
> > several
> > >      > times in JLReq. There are a lot of Japanese transliterations in
> the
> > >      > document as well, such as hanmen (版面), etc.
> > >
> > >     Yes, but kanji *is* the english translation for the japanese term
> > >     and is
> > >     used widely in english.  Hanzi is not widely used in english. It's
> a
> > >     translation oddity ;-)
> > >
> > >     And i think there was no real equivalent in english for hanmen.
> > >
> > >     This is not to say that the Japanese doc is perfect. Probably far
> from
> > >     it.  But i think we can account for those terms as I describe.
> > >
> > >      >> The standard uses Han character and Han ideographic character
> > >     most of
> > >      >> the time.
> > >      >>
> > >      >> I'm inclined to use 'Han character'.  There may be instances
> > where
> > >      >> what is meant is full-width character, if punctuation are to be
> > >      >> included. I haven't checked for those instances yet.
> > >      >
> > >      > I would prefer Han character now. Usually, when we say 漢字
> > orally or
> > >      > literally, it does not include punctuation, only the characters
> > >     themselves.
> > >
> > >     Ok. So who else do we need to check this with before replacing
> 'hanzi'
> > >     with 'han character' throughout?
> > >
> > >     ri
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
>
>
>
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