- From: Giorgos Stoilos <gstoil@image.ece.ntua.gr>
- Date: Fri, 20 Jul 2007 09:13:25 +0300
- To: "'Mike Pool'" <mpool@convera.com>, "'Ken Laskey'" <klaskey@mitre.org>, <Peter.Vojtas@mff.cuni.cz>
- Cc: <public-xg-urw3@w3.org>
> -----Original Message----- > From: Mike Pool [mailto:mpool@convera.com] > Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2007 9:29 PM > To: Giorgos Stoilos; Ken Laskey; Peter.Vojtas@mff.cuni.cz > Cc: public-xg-urw3@w3.org > Subject: RE: [URW3 public] OWL extensions [was Re: [URW3] ... three > questions based on the last telecon] > > Ken, > > Are you talking about extensions to the ontology that we're using > internally for use case annotation, i.e., > http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/urw3/wiki/UncertaintyOntology?action=At > tachFile&do=get&target=Uncertainty.owl? > > If so, I think we should all be given a deadline to approve this as the > "final rough draft" version before we impose such a high threshold on > adding extensions. > > Giorgos, I'm a bit puzzled by your response to the proposed extension, > but possibly because I misunderstand what is being proposed or the > intended usage of the ontology. We weren't suggesting that the ontology Hi, I was referring to Peter's extensions. Maybe I should have posted this separately. > we're using for use case annotation be proposed as an OWL extension for > w3c approval and universal usage, were we? If not, I don't think we > need to worry too much about whether or not extant tool sets can process Now I am confused :). The ontology is in OWL DL, right? So why wouldn't tools process it or why do you speak of an OWL extension? Anyway, I think that the ontology is a very nice effort and at this point I don't have any comments on it. -gstoil > it or whether it will meet with universal approbation, do we? > > (That aside, in the end, I think it's counterproductive for us to > constrain ourselves with an eye to what will fit easily within the > current OWL standards. We should at least allow ourselves the room to > draw the conclusion that it's entirely inadequate if that's what the > evidence and analysis suggests.) > > Best regards, > > Mike > > -----Original Message----- > From: public-xg-urw3-request@w3.org > [mailto:public-xg-urw3-request@w3.org] On Behalf Of Giorgos Stoilos > Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2007 1:30 PM > To: 'Ken Laskey'; Peter.Vojtas@mff.cuni.cz > Cc: public-xg-urw3@w3.org > Subject: RE: [URW3 public] OWL extensions [was Re: [URW3] ... three > questions based on the last telecon] > > > Hi Ken, > > This sounds reasonable enough. But let me also stress another issue. > > A proposed extension should be as minimal as possible in order to enjoy > acceptance by the non-uncertainty community and persuade people that it > could be adopted in their tools with a minimal effort. So also replying > to > Peter's mail, I do not agree with extensions like owl_ursw:usualy_oneOf, > owl_ursw:often_oneOf, owl_ursw:probably_subClassOf, which to me do not > seem > minimal. > > -gstoil > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: public-xg-urw3-request@w3.org > [mailto:public-xg-urw3-request@w3.org] > > On Behalf Of Ken Laskey > > Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2007 3:02 PM > > To: Peter.Vojtas@mff.cuni.cz > > Cc: public-xg-urw3@w3.org > > Subject: [URW3 public] OWL extensions [was Re: [URW3] ... three > questions > > based on the last telecon] > > > > > > Let me make a suggestion of a minimum criteria for adding extensions: > > > > an extension can be proposed only if you can show its use in the > > context of an already discussed use case. > > > > This is motivated by several thoughts: > > 1. we will have solid examples of the extension; > > 2. we can more easily compare value of the extension against others > > proposed; > > 3. we move forward our analysis of the use cases; > > 4. if proposed extensions can be demonstrated only in the context of > > use cases already discussed, some of you will have the motivation to > > volunteer for leading the discussion at future telecons :-) > > > > Do we have agreement on this proposal? > > > > Ken > > > > P.S. per survey results, I will be setting up telecons for August 1, > > August 22, September 5, and September 19. > > > > On Jul 18, 2007, at 7:20 AM, Peter Vojtas wrote: > > > > > > > > Colleagues, > > > let me note that this wonderfull discussion has started > by > > > questions about the nature of "sentence" and "proposition", and I > have > > > added a word used by W3C documents "statement" and as an example a > > > triple. Of course a RIF rule can be also a subject to attachment of > an > > > uncertainty. > > > I think this can be satisfactory solved by using current W3C > > > standards and interpretation of them. > > > > > > Now the problem has shifted a little bit further, to ontology. > My > > > impression is that we need to have some (easy) examples in the > begining > > > (Ken already assigned some sentences in his use case by uncertainty > > > type > > > and nature). > > > I like Mitch's ontology and so far only few extensions were > > > sugested - to have properties includesSentence, isaboutSentence and > a > > > new sort of uncertainty models namely Similarity (maybe some other > will > > > appear later - what are our criteria to enter new elements to > > > ontology). > > > The reification discussion was only an example from my part, and can > > > be soved > > > by Uncertainty has_derivation objective/subjective. > > > > > > I have also an idea and would like to ask ou for opinion. Most > of > > > Ontological knowledge is described by expressions about being an > > > element > > > and being a subset (equal to), e.g. > > > > > > owl:oneOf, rdf:type, ... rdfs:subClassOf, ... > > > > > > what do you think about extensions like > > > > > > owl_ursw:usualy_oneOf, owl_ursw:often_oneOf, > > > owl_ursw:probably_subClassOf > > > > > > or we are just going to assign uncertainty to the statement > > > A rdf:type B, C rdfs:subClassOf D, ... > > > > > > I agree that sentences can be structured by logical connectives, and > I > > > would be here very flexible and allow also fuzzy aggregation > > > operators. > > > > > > On the one side we are not going to specify syntax but we have to > show > > > current standards are not necessary (of course not because of the > > > syntax of current standards - using W3C syntax we have in mind that > > > their semantics does not suffice) > > > > > > Greetings Peter > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > ----- > > Ken Laskey > > MITRE Corporation, M/S H305 phone: 703-983-7934 > > 7151 Colshire Drive fax: 703-983-1379 > > McLean VA 22102-7508 > >
Received on Friday, 20 July 2007 06:15:08 UTC